Teams being considered for the Big 12?

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greenie78
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Academics are still important in this conference which is why most of the MWC is not being considered. UNLV like Rice, flat out suck on the field which is why they're not being considered as well. CSU is possibly being looked at as a Colorado replacement though their recent on field performance doesn't help. Tulane just like SDSU and SMU check off all the important things but they're having a hard time with a 4th team. That's why they most likely stick with SDSU and SMU for now unless they feel they need to add more. Tulane is next after those two.


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DfromCT wrote: Sun Mar 05, 2023 8:00 am unfortunately the biggest thing we have in common is a history of being lousy.
Despite the Cotton Bowl, we will still draw mostly negative criticism to any P conference that boldly invites us.
The first part is hilariously true. I don't think the second part is. As Ps expand, there will have to be a few "newcomers" who have shown intent to belong and we have earned that on a big stage.
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anEngineer wrote: Sun Mar 05, 2023 9:28 am
DfromCT wrote: Sun Mar 05, 2023 8:00 am unfortunately the biggest thing we have in common is a history of being lousy.
Despite the Cotton Bowl, we will still draw mostly negative criticism to any P conference that boldly invites us.
The first part is hilariously true. I don't think the second part is. As Ps expand, there will have to be a few "newcomers" who have shown intent to belong and we have earned that on a big stage.
Yes, but despite showing up like we did on 1/2/23, we still have to fight the bias against our long earned reputation. We still have one of the worst all-time winning percentages in FBS football, over 200 games under .500 since WWII. And unless we get the NY6 game again (and to some extent even if we do) the outcry from the fans will be much louder than they were in 2012.

We need to get the hell out of CUSAAC. But we're not going to be welcomed with open arms by whatever conference extends an invitation. It's going to be the same reaction as we saw when the Big East invited us.
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DfromCT wrote: Sun Mar 05, 2023 9:42 am But we're not going to be welcomed with open arms by whatever conference extends an invitation. It's going to be the same reaction as we saw when the Big East invited us.
That's their problem, not ours. They'll have to live with it. Big 12 said the same when TCU joined.
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The differences here and now is that we are noticeably better and that the PAC is desperate. Also, we clearly fit what PAC and ACC are.
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Bigschtick wrote: Sun Mar 05, 2023 9:18 am What about if the Pac12 implodes which some feel is likely, does SMU stays in the AAC or move into a merged Pac? / Mountain West? Implosion, if it happens, is likely to happen in the very near future with talk of the Big 12 communicating with AZ, AZ State, Colorado and Utah?
The AAC is joke without Houston, UCF and Cincinnati. SMU should bail in that scenario as a MWC/PAC combo is undoubtedly better than the new AAC. Heck, the MWC is probably better than the new AAC without any PAC members.
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RobertM320 wrote: Sun Mar 05, 2023 9:48 am
DfromCT wrote: Sun Mar 05, 2023 9:42 am But we're not going to be welcomed with open arms by whatever conference extends an invitation. It's going to be the same reaction as we saw when the Big East invited us.
That's their problem, not ours. They'll have to live with it. Big 12 said the same when TCU joined.
Your right, but it's also why we're not going to be invited just for the sake of expansion. TCU earned their invite, we need to do so by having more than one 10 win season. We've never had back to back 10 win seasons, now is the time for that first, and with the schedule we have there should be no excuse if we're as good as everyone assumes.
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greenie78 wrote: Sun Mar 05, 2023 8:43 am Rice is not being considered. That's been confirmed already. SDSU and SMU are the first two choices. If they want more, Tulane is probably next and Gonzaga for basketball only though the B12 has a better chance if they want. CSU has the academics and facilities though they've stunk the last few years on the football field. Fresno, Boise, UNLV and any other MWC team or AAC are not being considered.
CSU hired their own version of Willie Fritz last year--the former Nevada (Reno) head coach that flogged us in the Potato Bowl. He just finished a very good recruiting and portal transfer period. Like Willie with us, it will be a gradual rebuild at CSU, but they will likely get there, just as we have.
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Bigschtick wrote: Sun Mar 05, 2023 9:18 am What about if the Pac12 implodes which some feel is likely, does SMU stays in the AAC or move into a merged Pac? / Mountain West? Implosion, if it happens, is likely to happen in the very near future with talk of the Big 12 communicating with AZ, AZ State, Colorado and Utah?
Exactly. Trying to forecast the future PAC is very difficult with the Big 12 guillotine. hanging over their heads. And if the Big 12 can get the Four Corner teams, I have to believe that Washington and Oregon would come begging to the Big 12, assuming the Big 10 doesn't throw them a lifeline. That would leave the MWC to pick up the four remnants and enhance its G5 position. Then the question would be whether the MWC/PAC combination still wants a CTZ presence, so as to get a better TV contract.
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anEngineer wrote: Sun Mar 05, 2023 7:55 am
RobertM320 wrote: Sun Mar 05, 2023 7:43 am
DfromCT wrote: Sun Mar 05, 2023 7:02 am Why Rice? Do they really bring the Houston market?
Probably as much as we bring the New Orleans market.
I don't get the Rice thing either. While we are the only NCAA program in NOLA, there is a Big12 team now competing in Houston. We have also recently shown that we can capture major interest in NOLA. I'm not sure Rice can do that in Houston.
And we have much higher viewership ratings than Rice--and our surprisingly strong viewership ratings probably aren't from that many N.O. eyeballs, but rather from the Tulane alums throughout the country.
Last edited by HoustonWave on Sun Mar 05, 2023 4:30 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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RobertM320 wrote: Sun Mar 05, 2023 8:06 am
anEngineer wrote: Sun Mar 05, 2023 7:55 am
RobertM320 wrote: Sun Mar 05, 2023 7:43 am

Probably as much as we bring the New Orleans market.
I don't get the Rice thing either. While we are the only NCAA program in NOLA, there is a Big12 team now competing in Houston. We have also recently shown that we can capture major interest in NOLA. I'm not sure Rice can do that in Houston.
Major interest in a city of 400K is very different from major interest in a city of 4 million. My guess is, a Rice team going 10-2 in a conference other than CUSA would draw some interest, even if just from those that hate the Coogs. Especially if they're playing Washington, Arizona, Oregon St and Colorado instead of Marshall and La Tech.
Metropolitan New Orleans has 1.2 million people.
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Aberzombie1892 wrote: Sun Mar 05, 2023 8:51 am
greenie78 wrote: Sun Mar 05, 2023 8:43 am Rice is not being considered. That's been confirmed already. SDSU and SMU are the first two choices. If they want more, Tulane is probably next and Gonzaga for basketball only though the B12 has a better chance if they want. CSU has the academics and facilities though they've stunk the last few years on the football field. Fresno, Boise, UNLV and any other MWC team or AAC are not being considered.
I agree in that UNLV and Boise are likely off the table, but that doesn’t mean that omitting them is the right choice. CSU is a non-starter due to the presence of Colorado.
But CSU is in a pretty good position either way. If the Big 12 don't get the Four Corners teams, then CSU should be high on any Big 12 expansion list. If the Big 12 does snake the Four Corner teams from the PAC, I have to believe the PAC would quickly go after CSU to replace their Front Range presence. Without the Four Corner teams, the Big 12 best opportunity to go to 16 teams would be CSU, Tulane, SMU and either Memphis or USF.
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If the PAC hangs on the the 4 corners teams, we may get interest from both. Certainly the Big12 gives us a look.
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RobertM320
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Wave755 wrote: Sun Mar 05, 2023 11:47 am
RobertM320 wrote: Sun Mar 05, 2023 8:06 am
anEngineer wrote: Sun Mar 05, 2023 7:55 am

I don't get the Rice thing either. While we are the only NCAA program in NOLA, there is a Big12 team now competing in Houston. We have also recently shown that we can capture major interest in NOLA. I'm not sure Rice can do that in Houston.
Major interest in a city of 400K is very different from major interest in a city of 4 million. My guess is, a Rice team going 10-2 in a conference other than CUSA would draw some interest, even if just from those that hate the Coogs. Especially if they're playing Washington, Arizona, Oregon St and Colorado instead of Marshall and La Tech.
Metropolitan New Orleans has 1.2 million people.
And Metro Houston has almost 7M. I was comparing the city, not the metro area. Keep in mind, a large part of that 1.2M are avid LSU fans. You're not going to draw them. For example, parts of the River Parishes where I live are as close to LSU as they are to Tulane.

You think its just coincidence that Hahnville, Lutcher, East St John and Ascension all have purple and gold as their colors?
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HoustonWave wrote: Sun Mar 05, 2023 11:54 am
Aberzombie1892 wrote: Sun Mar 05, 2023 8:51 am
greenie78 wrote: Sun Mar 05, 2023 8:43 am Rice is not being considered. That's been confirmed already. SDSU and SMU are the first two choices. If they want more, Tulane is probably next and Gonzaga for basketball only though the B12 has a better chance if they want. CSU has the academics and facilities though they've stunk the last few years on the football field. Fresno, Boise, UNLV and any other MWC team or AAC are not being considered.
I agree in that UNLV and Boise are likely off the table, but that doesn’t mean that omitting them is the right choice. CSU is a non-starter due to the presence of Colorado.
But CSU is in a pretty good position either way. If the Big 12 don't get the Four Corners teams, then CSU should be high on any Big 12 expansion list. If the Big 12 does snake the Four Corner teams from the PAC, I have to believe the PAC would quickly go after CSU to replace their Front Range presence. Without the Four Corner teams, the Big 12 best opportunity to go to 16 teams would be CSU, Tulane, SMU and either Memphis or USF.
We're all playing "read the crystal ball" here but it's fun to do. I think this last scenario, laid out by HoustonWave, is the most hopeful one of all I've read or come up with that lands the Wave in the Big 12. And that would be a great spot for us with our former AAC mates (and some going back to the original C-USA) coupled with the legacy programs. It also makes sense to add another FL school as a travel partner, not to mention that USF and UCF have a heated rivalry despite USF not being very good lately. But I don't think SMU is going to be asked to back out of a PAC 12 invite, though stranger things have happened. TCU has a bigger grasp on the Metroplex TV market than SMU.
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DfromCT wrote: Sun Mar 05, 2023 12:38 pm
HoustonWave wrote: Sun Mar 05, 2023 11:54 am
Aberzombie1892 wrote: Sun Mar 05, 2023 8:51 am

I agree in that UNLV and Boise are likely off the table, but that doesn’t mean that omitting them is the right choice. CSU is a non-starter due to the presence of Colorado.
But CSU is in a pretty good position either way. If the Big 12 don't get the Four Corners teams, then CSU should be high on any Big 12 expansion list. If the Big 12 does snake the Four Corner teams from the PAC, I have to believe the PAC would quickly go after CSU to replace their Front Range presence. Without the Four Corner teams, the Big 12 best opportunity to go to 16 teams would be CSU, Tulane, SMU and either Memphis or USF.
We're all playing "read the crystal ball" here but it's fun to do. I think this last scenario, laid out by HoustonWave, is the most hopeful one of all I've read or come up with that lands the Wave in the Big 12. And that would be a great spot for us with our former AAC mates (and some going back to the original C-USA) coupled with the legacy programs. It also makes sense to add another FL school as a travel partner, not to mention that USF and UCF have a heated rivalry despite USF not being very good lately. But I don't think SMU is going to be asked to back out of a PAC 12 invite, though stranger things have happened. TCU has a bigger grasp on the Metroplex TV market than SMU.
Of the possible Big 12 candidates, SMU is definitely the longest shot. I think both TCU and Baylor will do all they can to keep SMU out of the Big 12.
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No one wants an odd number of baseball schools and SMU doesn't play baseball. If you take SMU, you need another non-baseball school and I'm not sure who that would be.
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anEngineer wrote: Sun Mar 05, 2023 4:54 pm No one wants an odd number of baseball schools and SMU doesn't play baseball. If you take SMU, you need another non-baseball school and I'm not sure who that would be.
Most likely Gonzaga since they don't play baseball, but I think they would rather go to the B12 if given the opportunity.
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greenie78 wrote: Sun Mar 05, 2023 5:03 pm
anEngineer wrote: Sun Mar 05, 2023 4:54 pm No one wants an odd number of baseball schools and SMU doesn't play baseball. If you take SMU, you need another non-baseball school and I'm not sure who that would be.
Most likely Gonzaga since they don't play baseball, but I think they would rather go to the B12 if given the opportunity.
Except the point of adding more schools is more football inventory. Gonzaga doesn't move the needle. For all we know, given the increase in revenue, PAC12 could have told SMU they need to add baseball as a sport.
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greenie78
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RobertM320 wrote: Sun Mar 05, 2023 5:06 pm
greenie78 wrote: Sun Mar 05, 2023 5:03 pm
anEngineer wrote: Sun Mar 05, 2023 4:54 pm No one wants an odd number of baseball schools and SMU doesn't play baseball. If you take SMU, you need another non-baseball school and I'm not sure who that would be.
Most likely Gonzaga since they don't play baseball, but I think they would rather go to the B12 if given the opportunity.
Except the point of adding more schools is more football inventory. Gonzaga doesn't move the needle. For all we know, given the increase in revenue, PAC12 could have told SMU they need to add baseball as a sport.
I agree. I don't think adding Gonzaga will do much for the PAC12 short-term or long-term. They need football schools and right now only 3 schools check all the marks they're looking for in recent on-field succes, market size, and academics.
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Don't know how legit this is coming from an Oregon St fan, but allegedly Tulane are one vote away from getting in the P12 having 7 out of the 8 votes needed.
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RobertM320 wrote: Sun Mar 05, 2023 12:08 pm
Wave755 wrote: Sun Mar 05, 2023 11:47 am
RobertM320 wrote: Sun Mar 05, 2023 8:06 am

Major interest in a city of 400K is very different from major interest in a city of 4 million. My guess is, a Rice team going 10-2 in a conference other than CUSA would draw some interest, even if just from those that hate the Coogs. Especially if they're playing Washington, Arizona, Oregon St and Colorado instead of Marshall and La Tech.
Metropolitan New Orleans has 1.2 million people.
And Metro Houston has almost 7M. I was comparing the city, not the metro area. Keep in mind, a large part of that 1.2M are avid LSU fans. You're not going to draw them. For example, parts of the River Parishes where I live are as close to LSU as they are to Tulane.

You think its just coincidence that Hahnville, Lutcher, East St John and Ascension all have purple and gold as their colors?
Actually, the “official” population of New Orleans is 388,000, with many demographers believing the true population is instead about 376,000. And, Metairie and River Ridge have many Wave fans. 😄
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RobertM320
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Did I not say 400K to begin with?
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RobertM320 wrote: Sun Mar 05, 2023 8:39 pm Did I not say 400K to begin with?
Metropolitan New Orleans has thousands of “crypto Tulane fans,” one good year won’t be enough for them to now come out from “deep cover.” This time, unlike ‘98, we must prove Tulane is “for real” for Div. 1 football. For everyone 35 and older the “sting of the 1999 season” is not forgotten. The 2023 season will be pivotal for this reason.
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Wave755 wrote: Sun Mar 05, 2023 10:16 pm
RobertM320 wrote: Sun Mar 05, 2023 8:39 pm Did I not say 400K to begin with?
Metropolitan New Orleans has thousands of “crypto Tulane fans,” one good year won’t be enough for them to now come out from “deep cover.” This time, unlike ‘98, we must prove Tulane is “for real” for Div. 1 football. For everyone 35 and older the “sting of 1999” is not forgotten. The 2023 season will be pivotal for this reason.
I think this team will be even better. More confident, more hardened from big games.
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