First Half Observations: Tulsa 10, Tulane 3

[RobertM320]

I'm watching the game on CST, so I thought I'd give my thoughts on the first half.

Defense is playing solid football. A couple of breakdowns, like that long run to set up the TD, but for the most part solid.

Griffin needs to do a better job of checking down to other receivers. On one long attempt to the end zone, he had a receiver wide open 25 yds downfield across the middle. Also, on the interception, he had a receiver wide open about 5 yards closer than the intended receiver, but he tried to force it to his primary target.

Bad clock mgmt at the end of the half by Toledo. If you're going to run the clock down to leave only time for one play, is there any reason NOT to try a Hail Mary?

As for attendance, I can't tell you, other than to say its better than last week.

[RobertM320]

BTW, what brilliant Tulsa alum decided that white names on a white jersey made sense?

[Robert1969]

Offense has been pathetic all day. I can only hear the radio, but what was Albert Williams doing on that play?

[RobertM320]

Offense has been pathetic all day. I can only hear the radio, but what was Albert Williams doing on that play?

He was grabbed and spun around by the Tulsa player, and when he came free running, he was running backwards. So, at that point he tried to make the best of it. I don't really fault him.

As for the offense being pathetic, I'm not going to pin this on the players. Let's be brutally honest. What we basically have is a competitive FCS team. Why? Because Cowen won't let us recruit more talented players because they don't fit the Tulane model academically, and Dickson won't hire a coach who can be creative because he's playing with inferior talent. Toledo's offense may be fine, if you have PAC-12 quality talent, but we don't.

It was amazing how many players on Tulsa's team were from Louisiana. Their backup QB played at East St. John, as did their RB, Singleton. Their stud suspended WR Demarius Johnson is from Norco (Destrehan), and their DB Howell that made the interception in the first half is from New Orleans. Why are these guys at Tulsa instead of at Tulane? Because Tulane didn't bother to recruit them and/or they couldn't because they wouldn't get in school anyway.

Again, I don't fault the guys we have, they play hard. We're just not talented enough. There's no reason a QB whose in the same system for three years isn't more comfortable and fluid on the field. For all the talk of Griffin learning from Drew Brees this summer, he obviously hasn't learned how to check down to second and third receivers. He locks in too much on his main target, and the defense picks up on it. Tulsa's defense should NOT be able to hold us to three points, even with the turnovers.

[DrBox]

But Tulsa's personnel suggests that our recruiting is not Cowen's fault. We recruited a lot of those players....Tulsa beat us. (McCoil, Rickey Johnson)
There are plenty of players we could get in La, but don't.

Remember when the main recruiting list was the Picayune? They'd have a 10 or 15 man blue chip list then a 20-25 man "best of the rest". We'd get 10 best of the rest, easy.
Now, we're lucky to get 2 top 40 players in La. (although the last 2 years has been better - maybe 5 each).

[sader24]

Talent or no talent, there were many oppurtunities squandered that could have made this a very close game. The coaching and offensive scheme are absolutely abysmal.

[RobertM320]

But Tulsa's personnel suggests that our recruiting is not Cowen's fault. We recruited a lot of those players....Tulsa beat us. (McCoil, Rickey Johnson)
There are plenty of players we could get in La, but don't.

Remember when the main recruiting list was the Picayune? They'd have a 10 or 15 man blue chip list then a 20-25 man "best of the rest". We'd get 10 best of the rest, easy.
Now, we're lucky to get 2 top 40 players in La. (although the last 2 years has been better - maybe 5 each).

I don't agree, Dr. Box. Our recruiting is directly affected by whom we can actually get in school. Cowen's refusal to allow us to accept players at the NCAA standards limits our recruiting tremendously.

I remember the old days when the list was in the Picayune, when we used to get our share. I'd also be willing to bet that the average GPA of the Top 40 Louisiana players in 2011 was significantly LOWER than it was in 1980. Therefore, fewer players on the list are even eligible to come to Tulane based on our standards.

[Robert1969]

There are institutional problems at Tulane that is responsible for the long term problems this program has, but I can't blame those problems on this specific game. I agree that we have an outdated offensive system. But there's also execution.

You get the ball at the 35 yard line after an interception, get help with a 15 yard penalty and have to settle for a field goal. You get inside the 35 on at least two other occasions and settled for field goal attempts. Get inside the 20 and wind up fumbling your way out of the opportunity. Even an outdated offensive system and modest talent would do better. How many dropped passes today?

Griffin staring down his receivers is less about his physical abilities and more about coaching. On that drive where we got to the fifteen on nothing but running before Albert Williams fumbled, we had set up a play action pass -- and it wasn't called. That's coaching. That's only tangentially Dickson's fault.

If you looked at the way the defense played most of the game, the talent is there. But offensively we didn't execute. That's partially coaching, and that's partially players not getting the job done. Now, all the way out here in Savannah, GA I can't see the game, but going by Graf's call, that's my take.

[DrBox]

But Tulsa's personnel suggests that our recruiting is not Cowen's fault. We recruited a lot of those players....Tulsa beat us. (McCoil, Rickey Johnson)
There are plenty of players we could get in La, but don't.

Remember when the main recruiting list was the Picayune? They'd have a 10 or 15 man blue chip list then a 20-25 man "best of the rest". We'd get 10 best of the rest, easy.
Now, we're lucky to get 2 top 40 players in La. (although the last 2 years has been better - maybe 5 each).

I don't agree, Dr. Box. Our recruiting is directly affected by whom we can actually get in school. Cowen's refusal to allow us to accept players at the NCAA standards limits our recruiting tremendously.

I remember the old days when the list was in the Picayune, when we used to get our share. I'd also be willing to bet that the average GPA of the Top 40 Louisiana players in 2011 was significantly LOWER than it was in 1980. Therefore, fewer players on the list are even eligible to come to Tulane based on our standards.

I'm not saying it isn't affected...I'm saying we aren't recruiting well enough on the kids we can recruit...we're either losing battles, not trying to recruit them, or making poor talent evaluations.
2 years ago we got swamped by La Tech in recruiting down here.
Now some of Tulsa's La players are JCs...those we definitely won't recruit.

[RobertM320]

There are institutional problems at Tulane that is responsible for the long term problems this program has, but I can't blame those problems on this specific game. I agree that we have an outdated offensive system. But there's also execution.

You get the ball at the 35 yard line after an interception, get help with a 15 yard penalty and have to settle for a field goal. You get inside the 35 on at least two other occasions and settled for field goal attempts. Get inside the 20 and wind up fumbling your way out of the opportunity. Even an outdated offensive system and modest talent would do better. How many dropped passes today?

Griffin staring down his receivers is less about his physical abilities and more about coaching. On that drive where we got to the fifteen on nothing but running before Albert Williams fumbled, we had set up a play action pass -- and it wasn't called. That's coaching. That's only tangentially Dickson's fault.

If you looked at the way the defense played most of the game, the talent is there. But offensively we didn't execute. That's partially coaching, and that's partially players not getting the job done. Now, all the way out here in Savannah, GA I can't see the game, but going by Graf's call, that's my take.

Ok, you say the talent is there. I don't agree. More talented players execute better. Try this scenario. If you had taken the purple and gold boys from upriver and put them on the field today, with Toledo calling the plays just like he did today, do we still lose by 28? No, we probably WIN by 14. Because the players would be MORE talented. I'm not asking for players as talented as an SEC school, I'd be happy with players who are comparable in talent to other CUSA schools.

[RobertM320]

I'm not saying it isn't affected...I'm saying we aren't recruiting well enough on the kids we can recruit...we're either losing battles, not trying to recruit them, or making poor talent evaluations.

I'm not arguing that we don't do well enough on the kids we can recruit..I agree with that. But the reality is, nationwide, the pool of FBS Division talent AS A WHOLE is not as talented academically as they were 25 years ago, which means a smaller percentage of that pool is even eligible to attend Tulane.

To compete, we need to change one of two things: Either we raise the academic abilities of the FBS recruits as a whole, which is impossible, or we modify our standards so we can increase the percentage of players that are available for us to recruit. Without one of these things happening, Nick Saban probably couldn't win here.

[Robert1969]

There are institutional problems at Tulane that is responsible for the long term problems this program has, but I can't blame those problems on this specific game. I agree that we have an outdated offensive system. But there's also execution.

You get the ball at the 35 yard line after an interception, get help with a 15 yard penalty and have to settle for a field goal. You get inside the 35 on at least two other occasions and settled for field goal attempts. Get inside the 20 and wind up fumbling your way out of the opportunity. Even an outdated offensive system and modest talent would do better. How many dropped passes today?

Griffin staring down his receivers is less about his physical abilities and more about coaching. On that drive where we got to the fifteen on nothing but running before Albert Williams fumbled, we had set up a play action pass -- and it wasn't called. That's coaching. That's only tangentially Dickson's fault.

If you looked at the way the defense played most of the game, the talent is there. But offensively we didn't execute. That's partially coaching, and that's partially players not getting the job done. Now, all the way out here in Savannah, GA I can't see the game, but going by Graf's call, that's my take.

Ok, you say the talent is there. I don't agree. More talented players execute better. Try this scenario. If you had taken the purple and gold boys from upriver and put them on the field today, with Toledo calling the plays just like he did today, do we still lose by 28? No, we probably WIN by 14. Because the players would be MORE talented. I'm not asking for players as talented as an SEC school, I'd be happy with players who are comparable in talent to other CUSA schools.

I think we made too many plays defensively to say the talent's not there. As for offensive execution, yeh, it was crap. But even good players fail to execute. I've seen the New Orleans saints receivers (who are a pretty talented bunch) get a case of the dropsies. Heck just this past week Marques Colston fumbled, and he wasn't even hit that hard (and that had a lot to do with why the Saints lost that game). Do you think Orleans Darkwa has talent? Does Albert Williams have talent? Does Ryan Grant have talent? Does Robert Kelley have talent? Again, if Ryan Griffin is staring down his receivers is that talent or poor coaching? If he's not looking for second and third options, is that talent or coaching? If offensive lineman whiff on their assignments, that might be talent, if they miss them altogether, that might be coaching. And sometimes, you just have a bad day. Or maybe the Seattle Seahawks are a more talented team than the New Orleans Saints.

[Robert1969]

But the reality is, nationwide, the pool of FBS Division talent AS A WHOLE is not as talented academically as they were 25 years ago, which means a smaller percentage of that pool is even eligible to attend Tulane.

25 years ago there were two division 1-A teams in Louisiana. Today there are five. That makes recruiting a lot harder in itself. And is there evidence for this claim that the pool of FBS talent is less academically talented than they were 25 years ago?

[RobertM320]

There are institutional problems at Tulane that is responsible for the long term problems this program has, but I can't blame those problems on this specific game. I agree that we have an outdated offensive system. But there's also execution.

You get the ball at the 35 yard line after an interception, get help with a 15 yard penalty and have to settle for a field goal. You get inside the 35 on at least two other occasions and settled for field goal attempts. Get inside the 20 and wind up fumbling your way out of the opportunity. Even an outdated offensive system and modest talent would do better. How many dropped passes today?

Griffin staring down his receivers is less about his physical abilities and more about coaching. On that drive where we got to the fifteen on nothing but running before Albert Williams fumbled, we had set up a play action pass -- and it wasn't called. That's coaching. That's only tangentially Dickson's fault.

If you looked at the way the defense played most of the game, the talent is there. But offensively we didn't execute. That's partially coaching, and that's partially players not getting the job done. Now, all the way out here in Savannah, GA I can't see the game, but going by Graf's call, that's my take.

Ok, you say the talent is there. I don't agree. More talented players execute better. Try this scenario. If you had taken the purple and gold boys from upriver and put them on the field today, with Toledo calling the plays just like he did today, do we still lose by 28? No, we probably WIN by 14. Because the players would be MORE talented. I'm not asking for players as talented as an SEC school, I'd be happy with players who are comparable in talent to other CUSA schools.

I think we made too many plays defensively to say the talent's not there. As for offensive execution, yeh, it was crap. But even good players fail to execute. I've seen the New Orleans saints receivers (who are a pretty talented bunch) get a case of the dropsies. Heck just this past week Marques Colston fumbled, and he wasn't even hit that hard (and that had a lot to do with why the Saints lost that game). Do you think Orleans Darkwa has talent? Does Albert Williams have talent? Does Ryan Grant have talent? Does Robert Kelley have talent? Again, if Ryan Griffin is staring down his receivers is that talent or poor coaching? If he's not looking for second and third options, is that talent or coaching? If offensive lineman whiff on their assignments, that might be talent, if they miss them altogether, that might be coaching. And sometimes, you just have a bad day. Or maybe the Seattle Seahawks are a more talented team than the New Orleans Saints.

Robert, I understand your points. I agree, those players have talent. I also feel a different offensive philosophy would make up for what talent deficiencies we have. If our talent is in the OL, you run behind that and bleed the clock. If you talent is in the skill positions, you open up your offense to take advantage of that.

I think the best example of that is when we went from Teevens to Bowden/RR. We had mostly the same talent, yet we went from a team that averaged 19.4 PPG in 1996 (86th in the nation) to one that averaged 34.1 PPG in 1997 (14th in the nation). You KNOW that the majority of that talent was the same.

However, I also don't think we'll ever be able to recruit the players we need to reach the goal we all want. I'm not looking to JUST be competitive in CUSA (although its the first step), I want us to be competitive with ALL the FBS teams. That won't happen unless we change the school policy.

[sader24]

Nick Saban would most certainly win here, you forget how easy our schedule is every year.

[RobertM320]

But the reality is, nationwide, the pool of FBS Division talent AS A WHOLE is not as talented academically as they were 25 years ago, which means a smaller percentage of that pool is even eligible to attend Tulane.

25 years ago there were two division 1-A teams in Louisiana. Today there are five. That makes recruiting a lot harder in itself. And is there evidence for this claim that the pool of FBS talent is less academically talented than they were 25 years ago?

Can I show you statistics and numbers, no. But I'd be willing to bet there are a lot fewer FBS players actually earning a degree now than there were 25 years ago. And these are people who are given an opportunity that a lot of other kids don't have; the opportunity to get a college education -- for FREE.

[RobertM320]

Nick Saban would most certainly win here, you forget how easy our schedule is every year.

Yeah, I know that was a bit extreme!

But that goes back to my point that a coach who is forced to play with a short deck because of talent needs to make up for it by being more creative with his philosophy.


And, I don't WANT our schedule to be this easy every year.

[DrBox]

But the reality is, nationwide, the pool of FBS Division talent AS A WHOLE is not as talented academically as they were 25 years ago, which means a smaller percentage of that pool is even eligible to attend Tulane.

25 years ago there were two division 1-A teams in Louisiana. Today there are five. That makes recruiting a lot harder in itself. And is there evidence for this claim that the pool of FBS talent is less academically talented than they were 25 years ago?

Our standards changed after the Point Shaving.
I don't recall us losing many recruiting battles to ULL or ULM since the early 1990s (and then to ULL). We've lost a few to Tech.
But look at all the teams from out of state recruiting here. It's skyrocketed...Colorado, Pitt, K State, Minnesota, SMU, Tulsa, USM, Houston, Arkansas, Texas A&M, Memphis, TCU. We left that door open.
It used to be FSU and A&M and they were basically recruiting LSU's players.

[RWR]

But the reality is, nationwide, the pool of FBS Division talent AS A WHOLE is not as talented academically as they were 25 years ago, which means a smaller percentage of that pool is even eligible to attend Tulane.

25 years ago there were two division 1-A teams in Louisiana. Today there are five. That makes recruiting a lot harder in itself. And is there evidence for this claim that the pool of FBS talent is less academically talented than they were 25 years ago?

Can I show you statistics and numbers, no. But I'd be willing to bet there are a lot fewer FBS players actually earning a degree now than there were 25 years ago. And these are people who are given an opportunity that a lot of other kids don't have; the opportunity to get a college education -- for FREE.

Student-Athletes graduate at higher rates than the general student population.

[RobertM320]

Student-Athletes graduate at higher rates than the general student population.

But students as a whole graduate at a lower rate than they did 25 years ago. So that proves nothing.

[RWR]

It proves you don't want to admit you're wrong.

[Robert1969]

But I'd be willing to bet there are a lot fewer FBS players actually earning a degree now than there were 25 years ago. And these are people who are given an opportunity that a lot of other kids don't have; the opportunity to get a college education -- for FREE.

You also have more guys leaving early for the NFL than in years past.

But let's go back to the coaching/talent debate. Tulane went from scoring 45 in the first week to 3 this week. Are most of the 42 points made up for by the relative talent of the opponents' defense? Or is this a matter of a coach who got complacent after seeing his offense drop 45, and then that rubbed off on players? I think it is mostly coaching complacency. Why? Because I've heard a lot of Toledo's half time comments to reporters and he usually thinks much more highly about the way things are going than they are. Toledo never seems to have a good grasp on the game situation, what's happening on the field, or how his game plan is NOT working and needs adjustment. I am sure this happens week to week.

Can anyone explain why he decided NOT to chunk the ball down the field for a hail mary at the end of the half, and, instead, just had griffin kneel on it? I mean most likely nothing happens there, but it's a seven point game, take a chance! Kneeling on it not only was a waste but it send a negative message to your team. You are down by seven at that point. Even if nothing happens your team knows you'll take any chance to give them a leg up. It was just a stupid situation.

[RobertM320]

But the reality is, nationwide, the pool of FBS Division talent AS A WHOLE is not as talented academically as they were 25 years ago, which means a smaller percentage of that pool is even eligible to attend Tulane.

25 years ago there were two division 1-A teams in Louisiana. Today there are five. That makes recruiting a lot harder in itself. And is there evidence for this claim that the pool of FBS talent is less academically talented than they were 25 years ago?

Our standards changed after the Point Shaving.
I don't recall us losing many recruiting battles to ULL or ULM since the early 1990s (and then to ULL). We've lost a few to Tech.
But look at all the teams from out of state recruiting here. It's skyrocketed...Colorado, Pitt, K State, Minnesota, SMU, Tulsa, USM, Houston, Arkansas, Texas A&M, Memphis, TCU. We left that door open.
It used to be FSU and A&M and they were basically recruiting LSU's players.

I agree, we left that door open. But you can't always say the recruits go elsewhere because of winning. A number of those schools haven't been very competitive either.

[RobertM320]

But I'd be willing to bet there are a lot fewer FBS players actually earning a degree now than there were 25 years ago. And these are people who are given an opportunity that a lot of other kids don't have; the opportunity to get a college education -- for FREE.

You also have more guys leaving early for the NFL than in years past.

But let's go back to the coaching/talent debate. Tulane went from scoring 45 in the first week to 3 this week. Are most of the 42 points made up for by the relative talent of the opponents' defense? Or is this a matter of a coach who got complacent after seeing his offense drop 45, and then that rubbed off on players? I think it is mostly coaching complacency. Why? Because I've heard a lot of Toledo's half time comments to reporters and he usually thinks much more highly about the way things are going than they are. Toledo never seems to have a good grasp on the game situation, what's happening on the field, or how his game plan is NOT working and needs adjustment. I am sure this happens week to week.

Can anyone explain why he decided NOT to chunk the ball down the field for a hail mary at the end of the half, and, instead, just had griffin kneel on it? I mean most likely nothing happens there, but it's a seven point game, take a chance! Kneeling on it not only was a waste but it send a negative message to your team. You are down by seven at that point. Even if nothing happens your team knows you'll take any chance to give them a leg up. It was just a stupid situation.

I agree. I questioned the kneeldown as well. And I also agree, he's not good at in-game adjustments. Don't know if complacency is the right word, though. Not sure what is.