Final call

The main discussion board for everything Tulane athletics related.
netshorty
High Tide
Posts: 444
Joined: Mon Oct 12, 2015 8:41 am
Status: Offline

Sun Nov 26, 2017 10:19 pm

winwave wrote:
netshorty wrote:
winwave wrote:net that call was on 3rd and two. If not called it would have been 4th. Might have changed the decision making.
You're absolutely right. the flag came out and immediately knew we had a new set of downs and I didn't even think about the fact it would have been 4th and thus a decision to kick or go for it. You think we would have kicked?
We'll never know but I do think he would have. I certainly hope he would have. We had the momentum. We had just wore out their D going into OT while ours got a breather.
Maybe so. It's semi-safer to kick (not much second guessing and it's a chip shot), but our lack of reliable place kicker makes OT dangerous. Thinking back to ULL game last year, the 48 yard field goal to extend to 4OT was simply a miracle...


winwave
Wild Pelican
Posts: 12872
Joined: Sat Jul 16, 2011 10:34 am
Status: Offline

Sun Nov 26, 2017 11:27 pm

We also scored a lot of TD's and that's what I would have been looking for in OT.
Thanks for the Happy Holiday's Wave Football and Volleyball!
netshorty
High Tide
Posts: 444
Joined: Mon Oct 12, 2015 8:41 am
Status: Offline

Mon Nov 27, 2017 7:40 am

Sorry for putting some guys to sleep with this one. Interesting analytics here about scoring on a TD on 1 play, which would have been the case if we had gone for it on 4th and 1 (had there been no PI on our 3rd down play).

[http://archive.advancedfootballanalyti ... y.html?m=1

Just 20% chance of scoring on 4th and 1 while it's about a 45-50% chance to score on 1st, 2nd or 3rd downs . Being the underdog we probably weren't 50% probability to win in OT but likely close to it. If WF was playing the best probability to win, you're right if you think that PI call likely altered the strategy there and kicking a FG to tie it was the best option (statistically speaking.)
netshorty
High Tide
Posts: 444
Joined: Mon Oct 12, 2015 8:41 am
Status: Offline

Mon Nov 27, 2017 7:56 am

netshorty wrote:Sorry for putting some guys to sleep with this one. Interesting analytics here about scoring on a TD on 1 play, which would have been the case if we had gone for it on 4th and 1 (had there been no PI on our 3rd down play).

[http://archive.advancedfootballanalyti ... y.html?m=1

Just 20% chance of scoring on 4th and 1 while it's about a 45-50% chance to score on 1st, 2nd or 3rd downs . Being the underdog we probably weren't 50% probability to win in OT but likely close to it. If WF was playing the best probability to win, you're right if you think that PI call likely altered the strategy there and kicking a FG to tie it was the best option (statistically speaking.)
Upon further studying, the 4th down TD % is lower as teams opt to kick. So that stat can't be used when you decide to go for it. The 1st - 3rd down % are a better indicator, all average around 45%. So probably close to a coin flip as to whether to go for it or try luck in OT. However one other variable not factored is make % of the FG. Wouldn't be the first time we missed a pretty short one at the end of the game.

Anyway, these are all what ifs and don't matter now... Just interesting if you like the statistical side...
Jaxwave
Surge
Posts: 931
Joined: Thu Dec 02, 2010 8:14 pm
Status: Offline

Mon Nov 27, 2017 9:08 am

IMHO I feel like we should have run a quick pass play then run Hilliard when it got down to the obvious last play call. I would not have played for OT on the road. Just seemed like us without a good kicker and their pass game was better, they would have been the favorite to win in OT.
galvezwave
Surge
Posts: 728
Joined: Thu Jun 23, 2011 9:34 am
Status: Offline

Mon Nov 27, 2017 9:31 am

Jaxwave wrote:IMHO I feel like we should have run a quick pass play then run Hilliard when it got down to the obvious last play call. I would not have played for OT on the road. Just seemed like us without a good kicker and their pass game was better, they would have been the favorite to win in OT.
I believe fritz said it was supposed to be a pass . he did say he trusted banks and didn't fault him for the attempt.

If any one caught the camera shot of our kicker pacing during that last drive, you'd know going for the td was the only decision . He looked terrified on the sidelines
nowave
Ripple
Posts: 55
Joined: Fri Apr 21, 2017 2:49 pm
Status: Offline

Mon Nov 27, 2017 9:40 am

seeing that video flips my opinion of if he got in. he did not. it also angers me even more about the play call as now it is clear that it was not the right play. kick a field goal go to overtime and win it there. still a gut wrenching loss but a pathetic excuse for play calling.
galvezwave
Surge
Posts: 728
Joined: Thu Jun 23, 2011 9:34 am
Status: Offline

Mon Nov 27, 2017 9:54 am

nowave wrote:seeing that video flips my opinion of if he got in. he did not. it also angers me even more about the play call as now it is clear that it was not the right play. kick a field goal go to overtime and win it there. still a gut wrenching loss but a pathetic excuse for play calling.
Banks changed the play.
User avatar
Show Me
Riptide
Posts: 2927
Joined: Fri Oct 21, 2011 9:24 pm
Location: Saint Bernard
Status: Offline

Mon Nov 27, 2017 10:45 am

nowave wrote:seeing that video flips my opinion of if he got in. he did not. it also angers me even more about the play call as now it is clear that it was not the right play. kick a field goal go to overtime and win it there. still a gut wrenching loss but a pathetic excuse for play calling.
Same here. Once again Tulane fails to “show me” otherwise. Troy don’t bother complaining to the league office it’s our own fault once again we’re home for the holidays. Win Homecoming for once then we’d be in.
nowave
Ripple
Posts: 55
Joined: Fri Apr 21, 2017 2:49 pm
Status: Offline

Mon Nov 27, 2017 12:46 pm

galvezwave wrote:
nowave wrote:seeing that video flips my opinion of if he got in. he did not. it also angers me even more about the play call as now it is clear that it was not the right play. kick a field goal go to overtime and win it there. still a gut wrenching loss but a pathetic excuse for play calling.
Banks changed the play.
ok but its the coachs responsibility to put the players in the best scenario. i dont blame banks running there because if everyone is covered what else is he supposed to do? a good coach takes that decision out of his players hands by putting the field goal unit out on the field and playing for overtime.our problem as it has always been is that we do not have a good coach.
netshorty
High Tide
Posts: 444
Joined: Mon Oct 12, 2015 8:41 am
Status: Offline

Mon Nov 27, 2017 2:11 pm

What we've learned is WF called for a pass play which is the right call, no doubt. Attempting a FG on 1st and goal with 9 seconds left would have been an absolute terrible call. Banks made a bad judgement call, in my opinion, as there wasn't a clear opening. And yes that is the risk of not kicking there. But honestly I would have been pissed if WF had them line up for a FG in that position. Especially if we ended up losing in OT or missing the kick (which we know is a crap shoot half the time anyway.) I mean "fire the a-hole" mad!
DfromCT
Tsunami
Posts: 6571
Joined: Tue Dec 27, 2011 1:50 pm
Location: Stamford, CT
Status: Offline

Mon Nov 27, 2017 2:15 pm

nowave wrote:
ok but its the coachs responsibility to put the players in the best scenario. i dont blame banks running there because if everyone is covered what else is he supposed to do? a good coach takes that decision out of his players hands by putting the field goal unit out on the field and playing for overtime.our problem as it has always been is that we do not have a good coach.
Throw the ball out of the back of the endzone, three or more rows into the stands, and lineup for another play with the clock stopped. Football 101. Actually, that's pre-football 101, it's something most grade school fans know.

And for my money, they got the call wrong. But the fumble TD that was called back I was very certain was the right call.
" For every alum, no matter where they are...I want a football coach that's going to make Saturday something you anticipate and look forward to." --Troy Dannen

Thank you all for your support as my son Zach continues to beat leukemia
galvezwave
Surge
Posts: 728
Joined: Thu Jun 23, 2011 9:34 am
Status: Offline

Mon Nov 27, 2017 2:30 pm

if banks had walked into the end zone standing up would the call have been bad?
netshorty
High Tide
Posts: 444
Joined: Mon Oct 12, 2015 8:41 am
Status: Offline

Mon Nov 27, 2017 2:37 pm

galvezwave wrote:if banks had walked into the end zone standing up would the call have been bad?
If it was a designed running play then yes it would have been a bad call, but we would have gotten lucky (in that we basically were saying that we're giving this just 1 shot). You do not call a designed run play in that position. AND WF stated he did not call a designed run play on that down. Bank improvised. Had he made it to the end zone standing up then he would have made a good judgement call. Because he did not, unfortunately it was a bad judgement call.
Pepper
Surge
Posts: 696
Joined: Thu Dec 02, 2010 7:38 pm
Status: Offline

Mon Nov 27, 2017 3:39 pm

nowave wrote:
galvezwave wrote:
nowave wrote:seeing that video flips my opinion of if he got in. he did not. it also angers me even more about the play call as now it is clear that it was not the right play. kick a field goal go to overtime and win it there. still a gut wrenching loss but a pathetic excuse for play calling.
Banks changed the play.
ok but its the coachs responsibility to put the players in the best scenario. i dont blame banks running there because if everyone is covered what else is he supposed to do? a good coach takes that decision out of his players hands by putting the field goal unit out on the field and playing for overtime.our problem as it has always been is that we do not have a good coach.

Jesus, the QB missed a wide open receiver in the end zone just a few plays earlier. The coaching staff had the team prepared to play, put the players in the right position to make the play and they just didn't execute. That's football. They supposedly made 1 more play than we did. SMU has 6 experienced P5 transfers on their roster along with a host of JC's. SMU was 2-10 & 5-7 the last 2 years before going bowling this year. They realized they needed some transfers to get over the hump. I'm hoping we can see that pattern works.
"Purple & Gold? You look ridiculous!"-Johnny Be Good.
User avatar
RobertM320
Tsunami
Posts: 6786
Joined: Thu Mar 10, 2011 8:18 pm
Location: Destrehan, LA
Contact:
Status: Offline

Mon Nov 27, 2017 5:11 pm

nowave wrote:
galvezwave wrote:
nowave wrote:seeing that video flips my opinion of if he got in. he did not. it also angers me even more about the play call as now it is clear that it was not the right play. kick a field goal go to overtime and win it there. still a gut wrenching loss but a pathetic excuse for play calling.
Banks changed the play.
ok but its the coachs responsibility to put the players in the best scenario. i dont blame banks running there because if everyone is covered what else is he supposed to do? a good coach takes that decision out of his players hands by putting the field goal unit out on the field and playing for overtime.our problem as it has always been is that we do not have a good coach.
He DID put the players in the best scenario. There was time for two plays, IF the first play is a pass. EVERY COACH in America in that situation would call a pass play, and then if unsucessful, some would go for it and some would kick a FG on the final play. You can't blame Fritz because Banks thought he had an opening to get in. And its Banks' job to make those decisions in the heat of the moment. This time he made a bad decision. Are you going to negate all the GOOD decisions he made that kept us in several games? And he didn't run because everyone was covered. He ran because he thought he saw an opening that would get us a TD. Simple as that.
"ASK AND YE SHALL RECEIVE! HANG EM AND BANG EM! HANG EM AND BANG EM!"-- Todd Graffagnini
winwave
Wild Pelican
Posts: 12872
Joined: Sat Jul 16, 2011 10:34 am
Status: Offline

Tue Nov 28, 2017 6:46 pm

Thanks for the Happy Holiday's Wave Football and Volleyball!
Post Reply