Bye Bye Payton Henson

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Re: Bye Bye Payton Henson

Postby sader24 » Thu May 07, 2015 10:07 pm

I don't think Conroy raised that money from Devlin. Rumor has it that it was the other way around.



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Re: Bye Bye Payton Henson

Postby puffy » Thu May 07, 2015 10:42 pm

jonathanjoseph wrote:
tpstulane wrote:
Profoundwizard wrote:Anyone still think this was about Payton's AAU coach trying to get paid?

Of course not. I said only the better players. He didn't even start for us. He saw the writing on the wall with the freshman coming in and left while he still had two years to get some PT. He wasn't going to get the PT he thought he deserved here.


Which player coming in is a stretch 4? Or even a regular 4? None of the incoming players have his skill set and Henson was going to see plenty of playing time.

Y'all going way over the top on some of these recruits and their impact as a freshman. The impact guys are all wings (and Julien) and the other guys are pure post players who will not see the floor over Osetkowski. There is little doubt in my mind that the roster has a hole at both the 1 and the 4, the two positions hit by transfers to Henson, Pinckney and Stark. Julien will be thrown into the first at the 1 but I think we no longer have a D1A 4 on the roster.


Just because Henson was lanky, perimeter oriented and tall, it didn't make him a stretch 4. He shot 13% from 3 in conference; no self respecting defense will pay much attention to anyone shooting that kind of percentage, which kills spacing and clogs up driving lanes to the hoop. He is a small forward who didn't show much range while in a Tulane uniform. I expect him to land in the Sun Belt, perhaps Arkansas St and could ultimately develop into a nice rotation player.

Osetkowski has the game and potential to develop into a stretch 4 or 5. He made as many in-conference 3s as Henson (4) while shooting a far better percentage (44%).

I expect Tulane to play a lot of small ball where three wings and two forwards, or four wings and one center, are racing up and down the floor. Duke won the national championship starting a true center, a 6'6" small forward at the 4, and three guards.
Last edited by puffy on Thu May 07, 2015 11:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.



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Re: Bye Bye Payton Henson

Postby Jonathan » Thu May 07, 2015 10:47 pm

Sorry the five who left do not have the athletic ability speed etc in my opinion over the new three and four star new recruits. A fact! We are going to have a great team next year add Malik Morgan the LSU A&M transfer to the mix with all of our new recruits. I know his sister is a star on our ladies basketball team. I hope that Conroy can recruit his younger brother now at John Curtis!



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Re: Bye Bye Payton Henson

Postby jonathanjoseph » Thu May 07, 2015 11:51 pm

puffy wrote:
jonathanjoseph wrote:
tpstulane wrote:
Profoundwizard wrote:Anyone still think this was about Payton's AAU coach trying to get paid?

Of course not. I said only the better players. He didn't even start for us. He saw the writing on the wall with the freshman coming in and left while he still had two years to get some PT. He wasn't going to get the PT he thought he deserved here.


Which player coming in is a stretch 4? Or even a regular 4? None of the incoming players have his skill set and Henson was going to see plenty of playing time.

Y'all going way over the top on some of these recruits and their impact as a freshman. The impact guys are all wings (and Julien) and the other guys are pure post players who will not see the floor over Osetkowski. There is little doubt in my mind that the roster has a hole at both the 1 and the 4, the two positions hit by transfers to Henson, Pinckney and Stark. Julien will be thrown into the first at the 1 but I think we no longer have a D1A 4 on the roster.


Just because Henson was lanky, perimeter oriented and tall, it didn't make him a stretch 4. He shot 13% from 3 in conference; no self respecting defense will pay much attention to anyone shooting that kind of percentage, which kills spacing and clogs up driving lanes to the hoop. He is a small forward who didn't show much range while in a Tulane uniform. I expect him to land in the Sun Belt, perhaps Arkansas St and could ultimately develop into a nice rotation player.

Osetkowski has the game and potential to develop into a stretch 4 or 5. He made as many in-conference 3s as Henson (4) while shooting a far better percentage (44%).

I expect Tulane to play a lot of small ball where three wings and two forwards, or four wings and one center, are racing up and down the floor. Duke won the national championship starting a true center, a 6'6" small forward at the 4, and three guards.


With all due respect, I cannot buy the opinion of someone who thinks Osetkowski could be a stretch 4. Very few people are born pure pivot post players and Osetkowski is one. He'll never play a single minute at any position but the 5.

Meanwhile, Henson's terrible shooting doesn't make him any less of a stretch 4. You can argue he was a bad stretch 4 or a poor shooting 4, but nonetheless a 4.



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Re: Bye Bye Payton Henson

Postby winwave » Fri May 08, 2015 6:46 am

Correct jj. The big O is a 5. Yes he made some three's but when he missed he missed wildly. He's our center and it will be a mistake to try him elsewhere. As for Henson anyone who watches every game would have had to see his development over the course of the season. He started playing more inside and got better there. As for his shot he always had good form and a quick release but couldn't get them to go in. After gaining confidence by playing better inside he finally started to hit his three's right at the end of the season. Te coaches wanted him to stay and he would have been the starter there.

I like us getting players that all have three stars from at least one service. I get that people are desperate for something to hang on to. It gives us some hope. But remember Pinckney was a 3 star who was rated the best PG in Georgia. While he showed a little improvement at the end of the year one would have expected more based on the rankings.


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Re: Bye Bye Payton Henson

Postby tpstulane » Fri May 08, 2015 7:16 am

winwave wrote:Correct jj. The big O is a 5. Yes he made some three's but when he missed he missed wildly. He's our center and it will be a mistake to try him elsewhere. As for Henson anyone who watches every game would have had to see his development over the course of the season. He started playing more inside and got better there. As for his shot he always had good form and a quick release but couldn't get them to go in. After gaining confidence by playing better inside he finally started to hit his three's right at the end of the season. Te coaches wanted him to stay and he would have been the starter there.

I like us getting players that all have three stars from at least one service. I get that people are desperate for something to hang on to. It gives us some hope. But remember Pinckney was a 3 star who was rated the best PG in Georgia. While he showed a little improvement at the end of the year one would have expected more based on the rankings.

I wouldn't agree that Henson started to develop just because he finally he hit two 3's ( half of what he made all season) against UH in a AAC first round tournament loss. That's like saying Aja Barto had 2 hits in his last Tulane baseball game. So next year he was going to come on. He still was only 4 for 30 in 3 pointers 13% in AAC play. This is the type of talent that won us only 15 games last season. It's just not good enough in this league. Osetkowski was a freshman last season that held his own. We need more like him. Many of the guys coming in will do the same including Malik Morgan. Henson is better suited in a league like CUSA. Had he stayed he would have been a guy that would have ate up 15 or so mins a game. If you want to say you lose experience I'll agree with that but not anything else. Had Cam Reynolds been healthy Henson wouldn't have avg 17 mins a game. Reynolds will move to that spot. He's a better 3 point shooter than Henson and will be a better uptempo player. People complained last season because O came out too much or didn't get enough mins. I would rather a freshman get those mins to develop. If you're a Tulane fan of any sort and not excited about this recruiting class you're missing out. The Frazier kid is light years better than Henson was as a freshman. He has a higher upside as well. Sadly enough if he or Reynolds just goes 5 for 30 from 3 point range we've improved at the 4 spot.


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Re: Bye Bye Payton Henson

Postby tpstulane » Fri May 08, 2015 7:46 am

jonathanjoseph wrote:
tpstulane wrote:
Profoundwizard wrote:Anyone still think this was about Payton's AAU coach trying to get paid?

Of course not. I said only the better players. He didn't even start for us. He saw the writing on the wall with the freshman coming in and left while he still had two years to get some PT. He wasn't going to get the PT he thought he deserved here.


Which player coming in is a stretch 4? Or even a regular 4? None of the incoming players have his skill set and Henson was going to see plenty of playing time.

Y'all going way over the top on some of these recruits and their impact as a freshman. The impact guys are all wings (and Julien) and the other guys are pure post players who will not see the floor over Osetkowski. There is little doubt in my mind that the roster has a hole at both the 1 and the 4, the two positions hit by transfers to Henson, Pinckney and Stark. Julien will be thrown into the first at the 1 but I think we no longstanding er have a D1A 4 on the roster.

6'7" Cam Reynolds will start In that spot. Henson only got more mins because Reynolds went down with season ending injury. I believe Cam got a medical redshirt last season so that bodes well for the future. He also brings the same experience as Henson had. His game is also better suited for uptempo. Henson was more of a set and shoot type guy.


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Re: Bye Bye Payton Henson

Postby puffy » Fri May 08, 2015 7:59 am

jonathanjoseph wrote:
puffy wrote:
jonathanjoseph wrote:
tpstulane wrote:
Profoundwizard wrote:Anyone still think this was about Payton's AAU coach trying to get paid?

Of course not. I said only the better players. He didn't even start for us. He saw the writing on the wall with the freshman coming in and left while he still had two years to get some PT. He wasn't going to get the PT he thought he deserved here.


Which player coming in is a stretch 4? Or even a regular 4? None of the incoming players have his skill set and Henson was going to see plenty of playing time.

Y'all going way over the top on some of these recruits and their impact as a freshman. The impact guys are all wings (and Julien) and the other guys are pure post players who will not see the floor over Osetkowski. There is little doubt in my mind that the roster has a hole at both the 1 and the 4, the two positions hit by transfers to Henson, Pinckney and Stark. Julien will be thrown into the first at the 1 but I think we no longer have a D1A 4 on the roster.


Just because Henson was lanky, perimeter oriented and tall, it didn't make him a stretch 4. He shot 13% from 3 in conference; no self respecting defense will pay much attention to anyone shooting that kind of percentage, which kills spacing and clogs up driving lanes to the hoop. He is a small forward who didn't show much range while in a Tulane uniform. I expect him to land in the Sun Belt, perhaps Arkansas St and could ultimately develop into a nice rotation player.

Osetkowski has the game and potential to develop into a stretch 4 or 5. He made as many in-conference 3s as Henson (4) while shooting a far better percentage (44%).

I expect Tulane to play a lot of small ball where three wings and two forwards, or four wings and one center, are racing up and down the floor. Duke won the national championship starting a true center, a 6'6" small forward at the 4, and three guards.


With all due respect, I cannot buy the opinion of someone who thinks Osetkowski could be a stretch 4. Very few people are born pure pivot post players and Osetkowski is one. He'll never play a single minute at any position but the 5.

Meanwhile, Henson's terrible shooting doesn't make him any less of a stretch 4. You can argue he was a bad stretch 4 or a poor shooting 4, but nonetheless a 4.


I said Osetkowski could be either va stretch 4 OR 5. If Tulane intends on running an uptempo offense, I'm certain there will be times on the floor when Osetkowski will be asked to camp out on the perimeter in order to draw out his defender and open up the lane. The fact that he has a developing ability to shoot 3's makes this a bigger concern for opposing defenses.

I thought your original argument (or someone else's) was that Henson was a stretch 4. I countered with why I felt he wasn't a good stretch 4. I also provided an example of a team that basically started one center, a g/f and three guards and had ultimate success in Duke.

If you feel that coventionally speaking Tulane doesn't currently have a 4 (or power forward) with Henson leaving, that's fine. To me, the game has evolved and become more perimeter oriented, so the lines of responsibility have been blurred with what each spot on the floor can and will be asked to do. Paul sounds like someone who can run, rebound and finish around the basket. He's not a "stretch" 4 (yet) but in every other metric he fits what a 4 is, perhaps moreso than Henson in my view. I wouldn't be surprised if Tulane from time to time plays Paul (or any of the other pf/c coming into the program) with four wings and have them press defensively and run offensively.



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Re: Bye Bye Payton Henson

Postby mbawavefan12 » Fri May 08, 2015 9:27 am

I guess I don;t understand the extension of this thread. The kid moved on and we filled his spot with what appears to be better players. Maybe you can complain that the roster instability may hurt recruiting in the future, but that's about it.

Sometimes good things do happen for TU fans, let's rejoice for a bit.



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Re: Bye Bye Payton Henson

Postby winwave » Fri May 08, 2015 11:02 am

tpstulane wrote:
winwave wrote:Correct jj. The big O is a 5. Yes he made some three's but when he missed he missed wildly. He's our center and it will be a mistake to try him elsewhere. As for Henson anyone who watches every game would have had to see his development over the course of the season. He started playing more inside and got better there. As for his shot he always had good form and a quick release but couldn't get them to go in. After gaining confidence by playing better inside he finally started to hit his three's right at the end of the season. Te coaches wanted him to stay and he would have been the starter there.

I like us getting players that all have three stars from at least one service. I get that people are desperate for something to hang on to. It gives us some hope. But remember Pinckney was a 3 star who was rated the best PG in Georgia. While he showed a little improvement at the end of the year one would have expected more based on the rankings.

I wouldn't agree that Henson started to develop just because he finally he hit two 3's ( half of what he made all season) against UH in a AAC first round tournament loss. That's like saying Aja Barto had 2 hits in his last Tulane baseball game. So next year he was going to come on. He still was only 4 for 30 in 3 pointers 13% in AAC play. This is the type of talent that won us only 15 games last season. It's just not good enough in this league. Osetkowski was a freshman last season that held his own. We need more like him. Many of the guys coming in will do the same including Malik Morgan. Henson is better suited in a league like CUSA. Had he stayed he would have been a guy that would have ate up 15 or so mins a game. If you want to say you lose experience I'll agree with that but not anything else. Had Cam Reynolds been healthy Henson wouldn't have avg 17 mins a game. Reynolds will move to that spot. He's a better 3 point shooter than Henson and will be a better uptempo player. People complained last season because O came out too much or didn't get enough mins. I would rather a freshman get those mins to develop. If you're a Tulane fan of any sort and not excited about this recruiting class you're missing out. The Frazier kid is light years better than Henson was as a freshman. He has a higher upside as well. Sadly enough if he or Reynolds just goes 5 for 30 from 3 point range we've improved at the 4 spot.


We'll have to agree to disagree on Henson. Reynolds has looked the part but hasn't really produced. He's got to toughen up to be a 4. As for the class no one has said they are not happy w/it. As for Frazier you need to read EC's comments and Frazier's in the Advocate. He is noted for his defense, rebounding and energy. He is said to be 6'5'' not 6'7''. He himself says he needs to work on ball handling and shooting. I know what the highlight film showed but those are quote's from the coach and player. Hopefully he lives up to the hype but appears to be another recruit in this class w/questions offensively.


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Re: Bye Bye Payton Henson

Postby winwave » Fri May 08, 2015 11:03 am

tpstulane wrote:
jonathanjoseph wrote:
tpstulane wrote:
Profoundwizard wrote:Anyone still think this was about Payton's AAU coach trying to get paid?

Of course not. I said only the better players. He didn't even start for us. He saw the writing on the wall with the freshman coming in and left while he still had two years to get some PT. He wasn't going to get the PT he thought he deserved here.


Which player coming in is a stretch 4? Or even a regular 4? None of the incoming players have his skill set and Henson was going to see plenty of playing time.

Y'all going way over the top on some of these recruits and their impact as a freshman. The impact guys are all wings (and Julien) and the other guys are pure post players who will not see the floor over Osetkowski. There is little doubt in my mind that the roster has a hole at both the 1 and the 4, the two positions hit by transfers to Henson, Pinckney and Stark. Julien will be thrown into the first at the 1 but I think we no longstanding er have a D1A 4 on the roster.

6'7" Cam Reynolds will start In that spot. Henson only got more mins because Reynolds went down with season ending injury. I believe Cam got a medical redshirt last season so that bodes well for the future. He also brings the same experience as Henson had. His game is also better suited for uptempo. Henson was more of a set and shoot type guy.


Reynolds will not start in that spot. If he does then this class will be a big let down.


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Re: Bye Bye Payton Henson

Postby tpstulane » Fri May 08, 2015 11:37 am

winwave wrote:
tpstulane wrote:
jonathanjoseph wrote:
tpstulane wrote:
Profoundwizard wrote:Anyone still think this was about Payton's AAU coach trying to get paid?

Of course not. I said only the better players. He didn't even start for us. He saw the writing on the wall with the freshman coming in and left while he still had two years to get some PT. He wasn't going to get the PT he thought he deserved here.


Which player coming in is a stretch 4? Or even a regular 4? None of the incoming players have his skill set and Henson was going to see plenty of playing time.

Y'all going way over the top on some of these recruits and their impact as a freshman. The impact guys are all wings (and Julien) and the other guys are pure post players who will not see the floor over Osetkowski. There is little doubt in my mind that the roster has a hole at both the 1 and the 4, the two positions hit by transfers to Henson, Pinckney and Stark. Julien will be thrown into the first at the 1 but I think we no longstanding er have a D1A 4 on the roster.

6'7" Cam Reynolds will start In that spot. Henson only got more mins because Reynolds went down with season ending injury. I believe Cam got a medical redshirt last season so that bodes well for the future. He also brings the same experience as Henson had. His game is also better suited for uptempo. Henson was more of a set and shoot type guy.


Reynolds will not start in that spot. If he does then this class will be a big let down.

Well who then if not Reynolds?
The one guy we are going to miss is Jay Hook and that's it.


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Re: Bye Bye Payton Henson

Postby mbawavefan12 » Fri May 08, 2015 11:40 am

tpstulane wrote:
winwave wrote:
tpstulane wrote:
jonathanjoseph wrote:
tpstulane wrote:
Profoundwizard wrote:Anyone still think this was about Payton's AAU coach trying to get paid?

Of course not. I said only the better players. He didn't even start for us. He saw the writing on the wall with the freshman coming in and left while he still had two years to get some PT. He wasn't going to get the PT he thought he deserved here.


Which player coming in is a stretch 4? Or even a regular 4? None of the incoming players have his skill set and Henson was going to see plenty of playing time.

Y'all going way over the top on some of these recruits and their impact as a freshman. The impact guys are all wings (and Julien) and the other guys are pure post players who will not see the floor over Osetkowski. There is little doubt in my mind that the roster has a hole at both the 1 and the 4, the two positions hit by transfers to Henson, Pinckney and Stark. Julien will be thrown into the first at the 1 but I think we no longstanding er have a D1A 4 on the roster.

6'7" Cam Reynolds will start In that spot. Henson only got more mins because Reynolds went down with season ending injury. I believe Cam got a medical redshirt last season so that bodes well for the future. He also brings the same experience as Henson had. His game is also better suited for uptempo. Henson was more of a set and shoot type guy.


Reynolds will not start in that spot. If he does then this class will be a big let down.

Well who then if not Reynolds?
The one guy we are going to miss is Jay Hook and that's it.


Can't believe people have so much faith in freshmen. These are great pickups for Tulane but are not Kentucky/Duke recruits.



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Re: Bye Bye Payton Henson

Postby tpstulane » Fri May 08, 2015 11:54 am

mbawavefan12 wrote:
tpstulane wrote:
winwave wrote:
tpstulane wrote:
jonathanjoseph wrote:
tpstulane wrote:
Profoundwizard wrote:Anyone still think this was about Payton's AAU coach trying to get paid?

Of course not. I said only the better players. He didn't even start for us. He saw the writing on the wall with the freshman coming in and left while he still had two years to get some PT. He wasn't going to get the PT he thought he deserved here.


Which player coming in is a stretch 4? Or even a regular 4? None of the incoming players have his skill set and Henson was going to see plenty of playing time.

Y'all going way over the top on some of these recruits and their impact as a freshman. The impact guys are all wings (and Julien) and the other guys are pure post players who will not see the floor over Osetkowski. There is little doubt in my mind that the roster has a hole at both the 1 and the 4, the two positions hit by transfers to Henson, Pinckney and Stark. Julien will be thrown into the first at the 1 but I think we no longstanding er have a D1A 4 on the roster.

6'7" Cam Reynolds will start In that spot. Henson only got more mins because Reynolds went down with season ending injury. I believe Cam got a medical redshirt last season so that bodes well for the future. He also brings the same experience as Henson had. His game is also better suited for uptempo. Henson was more of a set and shoot type guy.


Reynolds will not start in that spot. If he does then this class will be a big let down.

Well who then if not Reynolds?
The one guy we are going to miss is Jay Hook and that's it.


Can't believe people have so much faith in freshmen. These are great pickups for Tulane but are not Kentucky/Duke recruits.

I don't think people are saying that. On paper they grade out as the best class in 20 years. Until they prove it on the court it's just that. However look at our roster last year vs the other teams in the league. We didn't match up with the athleticism the top teams had. Osetkowski was only a freshman and he outperformed most of the upperclassmen. Having a former NC and NBA player on this staff is huge. The guy knows talent and has connections to deliver it. I think more people are happy about this class than are not. Nothing could be worse than how we collapsed at the end of last season after a promising start. We wore down as the season progressed. The talent just wasn't there to compete with the top of the league. If you complained about last season then you should be happy to see most of the guys gone.


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Re: Bye Bye Payton Henson

Postby mbawavefan12 » Fri May 08, 2015 11:59 am

tpstulane wrote:
mbawavefan12 wrote:
tpstulane wrote:
winwave wrote:
tpstulane wrote:
jonathanjoseph wrote:
tpstulane wrote:
Profoundwizard wrote:Anyone still think this was about Payton's AAU coach trying to get paid?

Of course not. I said only the better players. He didn't even start for us. He saw the writing on the wall with the freshman coming in and left while he still had two years to get some PT. He wasn't going to get the PT he thought he deserved here.


Which player coming in is a stretch 4? Or even a regular 4? None of the incoming players have his skill set and Henson was going to see plenty of playing time.

Y'all going way over the top on some of these recruits and their impact as a freshman. The impact guys are all wings (and Julien) and the other guys are pure post players who will not see the floor over Osetkowski. There is little doubt in my mind that the roster has a hole at both the 1 and the 4, the two positions hit by transfers to Henson, Pinckney and Stark. Julien will be thrown into the first at the 1 but I think we no longstanding er have a D1A 4 on the roster.

6'7" Cam Reynolds will start In that spot. Henson only got more mins because Reynolds went down with season ending injury. I believe Cam got a medical redshirt last season so that bodes well for the future. He also brings the same experience as Henson had. His game is also better suited for uptempo. Henson was more of a set and shoot type guy.


Reynolds will not start in that spot. If he does then this class will be a big let down.

Well who then if not Reynolds?
The one guy we are going to miss is Jay Hook and that's it.


Can't believe people have so much faith in freshmen. These are great pickups for Tulane but are not Kentucky/Duke recruits.

I don't think people are saying that. On paper they grade out as the best class in 20 years. Until they prove it on the court it's just that. However look at our roster last year vs the other teams in the league. We didn't match up with the athleticism the top teams had. Osetkowski was only a freshman and he outperformed most of the upperclassmen. Having a former NC and NBA player on this staff is huge. The guy knows talent and has connections to deliver it. I think more people are happy about this class than are not. Nothing could be worse than how we collapsed at the end of last season after a promising start. We wore down as the season progressed. The talent just wasn't there to compete with the top of the league. If you complained about last season then you should be happy to see most of the guys gone.


You said we will only miss Hook, thus freshmen running the point as opposed to a JR former all CUSA freshman. Yes Stark had his flaws and had a down soph year but again how much of that was the system and coaches. He would still get minutes with almost any team in the conference.



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Re: Bye Bye Payton Henson

Postby tpstulane » Fri May 08, 2015 12:01 pm

mbawavefan12 wrote:
tpstulane wrote:
mbawavefan12 wrote:
tpstulane wrote:
winwave wrote:
tpstulane wrote:
jonathanjoseph wrote:
tpstulane wrote:
Profoundwizard wrote:Anyone still think this was about Payton's AAU coach trying to get paid?

Of course not. I said only the better players. He didn't even start for us. He saw the writing on the wall with the freshman coming in and left while he still had two years to get some PT. He wasn't going to get the PT he thought he deserved here.


Which player coming in is a stretch 4? Or even a regular 4? None of the incoming players have his skill set and Henson was going to see plenty of playing time.

Y'all going way over the top on some of these recruits and their impact as a freshman. The impact guys are all wings (and Julien) and the other guys are pure post players who will not see the floor over Osetkowski. There is little doubt in my mind that the roster has a hole at both the 1 and the 4, the two positions hit by transfers to Henson, Pinckney and Stark. Julien will be thrown into the first at the 1 but I think we no longstanding er have a D1A 4 on the roster.

6'7" Cam Reynolds will start In that spot. Henson only got more mins because Reynolds went down with season ending injury. I believe Cam got a medical redshirt last season so that bodes well for the future. He also brings the same experience as Henson had. His game is also better suited for uptempo. Henson was more of a set and shoot type guy.


Reynolds will not start in that spot. If he does then this class will be a big let down.

Well who then if not Reynolds?
The one guy we are going to miss is Jay Hook and that's it.


Can't believe people have so much faith in freshmen. These are great pickups for Tulane but are not Kentucky/Duke recruits.

I don't think people are saying that. On paper they grade out as the best class in 20 years. Until they prove it on the court it's just that. However look at our roster last year vs the other teams in the league. We didn't match up with the athleticism the top teams had. Osetkowski was only a freshman and he outperformed most of the upperclassmen. Having a former NC and NBA player on this staff is huge. The guy knows talent and has connections to deliver it. I think more people are happy about this class than are not. Nothing could be worse than how we collapsed at the end of last season after a promising start. We wore down as the season progressed. The talent just wasn't there to compete with the top of the league. If you complained about last season then you should be happy to see most of the guys gone.


You said we will only miss Hook, thus freshmen running the point as opposed to a JR former all CUSA freshman. Yes Stark had his flaws and had a down soph year but again how much of that was the system and coaches. He would still get minutes with almost any team in the conference.

Stark did great in CUSA with the same system. His game didn't translate as well against AAC competition. We'll miss his experience not his talent. Just like he replaced Tarrant, Julien will replace him. Only Hook, Dabney and Osetkowski were players that competed against the better AAC teams. The rest were bodies taking up space and minutes on the floor. That's what I saw last year.


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Re: Bye Bye Payton Henson

Postby mbawavefan12 » Fri May 08, 2015 12:10 pm

tpstulane wrote:
mbawavefan12 wrote:
tpstulane wrote:
mbawavefan12 wrote:
tpstulane wrote:
winwave wrote:
tpstulane wrote:
jonathanjoseph wrote:
tpstulane wrote:
Profoundwizard wrote:Anyone still think this was about Payton's AAU coach trying to get paid?

Of course not. I said only the better players. He didn't even start for us. He saw the writing on the wall with the freshman coming in and left while he still had two years to get some PT. He wasn't going to get the PT he thought he deserved here.


Which player coming in is a stretch 4? Or even a regular 4? None of the incoming players have his skill set and Henson was going to see plenty of playing time.

Y'all going way over the top on some of these recruits and their impact as a freshman. The impact guys are all wings (and Julien) and the other guys are pure post players who will not see the floor over Osetkowski. There is little doubt in my mind that the roster has a hole at both the 1 and the 4, the two positions hit by transfers to Henson, Pinckney and Stark. Julien will be thrown into the first at the 1 but I think we no longstanding er have a D1A 4 on the roster.

6'7" Cam Reynolds will start In that spot. Henson only got more mins because Reynolds went down with season ending injury. I believe Cam got a medical redshirt last season so that bodes well for the future. He also brings the same experience as Henson had. His game is also better suited for uptempo. Henson was more of a set and shoot type guy.


Reynolds will not start in that spot. If he does then this class will be a big let down.

Well who then if not Reynolds?
The one guy we are going to miss is Jay Hook and that's it.


Can't believe people have so much faith in freshmen. These are great pickups for Tulane but are not Kentucky/Duke recruits.

I don't think people are saying that. On paper they grade out as the best class in 20 years. Until they prove it on the court it's just that. However look at our roster last year vs the other teams in the league. We didn't match up with the athleticism the top teams had. Osetkowski was only a freshman and he outperformed most of the upperclassmen. Having a former NC and NBA player on this staff is huge. The guy knows talent and has connections to deliver it. I think more people are happy about this class than are not. Nothing could be worse than how we collapsed at the end of last season after a promising start. We wore down as the season progressed. The talent just wasn't there to compete with the top of the league. If you complained about last season then you should be happy to see most of the guys gone.


You said we will only miss Hook, thus freshmen running the point as opposed to a JR former all CUSA freshman. Yes Stark had his flaws and had a down soph year but again how much of that was the system and coaches. He would still get minutes with almost any team in the conference.

Stark did great in CUSA with the same system. His game didn't translate as well against AAC competition. We'll miss his experience not his talent. Just like he replaced Tarrant, Julien will replace him. Only Hook, Dabney and Osetkowski were players that competed against the better AAC teams. The rest were bodies taking up space and minutes on the floor. That's what I saw last year.


Dabney and Stark shot the same FG %. Stark was third in the league in assists. Tough critic.



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Re: Bye Bye Payton Henson

Postby jonathanjoseph » Fri May 08, 2015 12:28 pm

tpstulane wrote:
I don't think people are saying that. On paper they grade out as the best class in 20 years. Until they prove it on the court it's just that. However look at our roster last year vs the other teams in the league. We didn't match up with the athleticism the top teams had. Osetkowski was only a freshman and he outperformed most of the upperclassmen. Having a former NC and NBA player on this staff is huge. The guy knows talent and has connections to deliver it. I think more people are happy about this class than are not. Nothing could be worse than how we collapsed at the end of last season after a promising start. We wore down as the season progressed. The talent just wasn't there to compete with the top of the league. If you complained about last season then you should be happy to see most of the guys gone.


I think there are two different issues here. One is the recruiting class, which is a significant improvement from what we've seen previously from Conroy or any basketball coach under Dickson. That being said, we're only 20 years from having one of the top recruiting classes in the country, we need to get near the top of the AAC first. This recruiting class is a fantastic step in the right direction and I don't think anyone has suggested otherwise.

The other issue is that quality kids like Henson are leaving. Irrespective of the recruiting class, this is not the sign of a healthy program. If players want to leave in these numbers what do you think is going to happen when schools without the bumbling idiot Rick Dickson start offering Shammond Williams more money and better coaches facilities (with a free microwave!)?

The recruiting class is great, but Henson's departure will leave a hole on the roster as well as signals continued deeper problems with the program.



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Re: Bye Bye Payton Henson

Postby tpstulane » Fri May 08, 2015 12:43 pm

mbawavefan12 wrote:
tpstulane wrote:
mbawavefan12 wrote:
tpstulane wrote:
mbawavefan12 wrote:
tpstulane wrote:
winwave wrote:
tpstulane wrote:
jonathanjoseph wrote:
tpstulane wrote:
Profoundwizard wrote:Anyone still think this was about Payton's AAU coach trying to get paid?

Of course not. I said only the better players. He didn't even start for us. He saw the writing on the wall with the freshman coming in and left while he still had two years to get some PT. He wasn't going to get the PT he thought he deserved here.


Which player coming in is a stretch 4? Or even a regular 4? None of the incoming players have his skill set and Henson was going to see plenty of playing time.

Y'all going way over the top on some of these recruits and their impact as a freshman. The impact guys are all wings (and Julien) and the other guys are pure post players who will not see the floor over Osetkowski. There is little doubt in my mind that the roster has a hole at both the 1 and the 4, the two positions hit by transfers to Henson, Pinckney and Stark. Julien will be thrown into the first at the 1 but I think we no longstanding er have a D1A 4 on the roster.

6'7" Cam Reynolds will start In that spot. Henson only got more mins because Reynolds went down with season ending injury. I believe Cam got a medical redshirt last season so that bodes well for the future. He also brings the same experience as Henson had. His game is also better suited for uptempo. Henson was more of a set and shoot type guy.


Reynolds will not start in that spot. If he does then this class will be a big let down.

Well who then if not Reynolds?
The one guy we are going to miss is Jay Hook and that's it.


Can't believe people have so much faith in freshmen. These are great pickups for Tulane but are not Kentucky/Duke recruits.

I don't think people are saying that. On paper they grade out as the best class in 20 years. Until they prove it on the court it's just that. However look at our roster last year vs the other teams in the league. We didn't match up with the athleticism the top teams had. Osetkowski was only a freshman and he outperformed most of the upperclassmen. Having a former NC and NBA player on this staff is huge. The guy knows talent and has connections to deliver it. I think more people are happy about this class than are not. Nothing could be worse than how we collapsed at the end of last season after a promising start. We wore down as the season progressed. The talent just wasn't there to compete with the top of the league. If you complained about last season then you should be happy to see most of the guys gone.


You said we will only miss Hook, thus freshmen running the point as opposed to a JR former all CUSA freshman. Yes Stark had his flaws and had a down soph year but again how much of that was the system and coaches. He would still get minutes with almost any team in the conference.

Stark did great in CUSA with the same system. His game didn't translate as well against AAC competition. We'll miss his experience not his talent. Just like he replaced Tarrant, Julien will replace him. Only Hook, Dabney and Osetkowski were players that competed against the better AAC teams. The rest were bodies taking up space and minutes on the floor. That's what I saw last year.


Dabney and Stark shot the same FG %. Stark was third in the league in assists. Tough critic.

Yes. But his game wasn't the same in this league. Dabney IMO was more valuable because he was able to at least create his own shot. He had many blocked doing so which killed his %. Stark shot more outside stuff. Bottom line Stark is replaceable.


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Re: Bye Bye Payton Henson

Postby tpstulane » Fri May 08, 2015 12:48 pm

jonathanjoseph wrote:
tpstulane wrote:
I don't think people are saying that. On paper they grade out as the best class in 20 years. Until they prove it on the court it's just that. However look at our roster last year vs the other teams in the league. We didn't match up with the athleticism the top teams had. Osetkowski was only a freshman and he outperformed most of the upperclassmen. Having a former NC and NBA player on this staff is huge. The guy knows talent and has connections to deliver it. I think more people are happy about this class than are not. Nothing could be worse than how we collapsed at the end of last season after a promising start. We wore down as the season progressed. The talent just wasn't there to compete with the top of the league. If you complained about last season then you should be happy to see most of the guys gone.


I think there are two different issues here. One is the recruiting class, which is a significant improvement from what we've seen previously from Conroy or any basketball coach under Dickson. That being said, we're only 20 years from having one of the top recruiting classes in the country, we need to get near the top of the AAC first. This recruiting class is a fantastic step in the right direction and I don't think anyone has suggested otherwise.

The other issue is that quality kids like Henson are leaving. Irrespective of the recruiting class, this is not the sign of a healthy program. If players want to leave in these numbers what do you think is going to happen when schools without the bumbling idiot Rick Dickson start offering Shammond Williams more money and better coaches facilities (with a free microwave!)?

The recruiting class is great, but Henson's departure will leave a hole on the roster as well as signals continued deeper problems with the program.

JJ he shot 13% from 3 and in the 30's from the field. If that's what you call quality then you have very a low bar. We may miss his experience but that's all.


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Re: Bye Bye Payton Henson

Postby winwave » Fri May 08, 2015 1:01 pm

tpstulane wrote:
winwave wrote:
tpstulane wrote:
jonathanjoseph wrote:
tpstulane wrote:
Profoundwizard wrote:Anyone still think this was about Payton's AAU coach trying to get paid?

Of course not. I said only the better players. He didn't even start for us. He saw the writing on the wall with the freshman coming in and left while he still had two years to get some PT. He wasn't going to get the PT he thought he deserved here.


Which player coming in is a stretch 4? Or even a regular 4? None of the incoming players have his skill set and Henson was going to see plenty of playing time.

Y'all going way over the top on some of these recruits and their impact as a freshman. The impact guys are all wings (and Julien) and the other guys are pure post players who will not see the floor over Osetkowski. There is little doubt in my mind that the roster has a hole at both the 1 and the 4, the two positions hit by transfers to Henson, Pinckney and Stark. Julien will be thrown into the first at the 1 but I think we no longstanding er have a D1A 4 on the roster.

6'7" Cam Reynolds will start In that spot. Henson only got more mins because Reynolds went down with season ending injury. I believe Cam got a medical redshirt last season so that bodes well for the future. He also brings the same experience as Henson had. His game is also better suited for uptempo. Henson was more of a set and shoot type guy.


Reynolds will not start in that spot. If he does then this class will be a big let down.

Well who then if not Reynolds?
The one guy we are going to miss is Jay Hook and that's it.


Paul or Oliver.

We will miss Stark and Henson.

As for your latest mantra about people not being happy w/the class it is meritless. Not one person has said they are unhappy w/the incoming class. Just b/c people want to discuss it doesn't mean they aren't happy. This site allows such discussion.


It's the facilities stupid!

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Re: Bye Bye Payton Henson

Postby tpstulane » Fri May 08, 2015 1:10 pm

    winwave wrote:
    tpstulane wrote:
    winwave wrote:
    tpstulane wrote:
    jonathanjoseph wrote:
    tpstulane wrote:
    Profoundwizard wrote:Anyone still think this was about Payton's AAU coach trying to get paid?

    Of course not. I said only the better players. He didn't even start for us. He saw the writing on the wall with the freshman coming in and left while he still had two years to get some PT. He wasn't going to get the PT he thought he deserved here.


    Which player coming in is a stretch 4? Or even a regular 4? None of the incoming players have his skill set and Henson was going to see plenty of playing time.

    Y'all going way over the top on some of these recruits and their impact as a freshman. The impact guys are all wings (and Julien) and the other guys are pure post players who will not see the floor over Osetkowski. There is little doubt in my mind that the roster has a hole at both the 1 and the 4, the two positions hit by transfers to Henson, Pinckney and Stark. Julien will be thrown into the first at the 1 but I think we no longstanding er have a D1A 4 on the roster.

    6'7" Cam Reynolds will start In that spot. Henson only got more mins because Reynolds went down with season ending injury. I believe Cam got a medical redshirt last season so that bodes well for the future. He also brings the same experience as Henson had. His game is also better suited for uptempo. Henson was more of a set and shoot type guy.


    Reynolds will not start in that spot. If he does then this class will be a big let down.

    Well who then if not Reynolds?
    The one guy we are going to miss is Jay Hook and that's it.


    Paul or Oliver.

    We will miss Stark and Henson.

    As for your latest mantra about people not being happy w/the class it is meritless. Not one person has said they are unhappy w/the incoming class. Just b/c people want to discuss it doesn't mean they aren't happy. This site allows such discussion.

    Right. It also allows positive thoughts as well as the negative. People said we'd miss Tarrant. Stark filled in well as a CUSA freshman. Henson has never done anything that I would miss on the court. Like I said his experience may be missed with all the freshman we'll have on the roster. You can miss them. I won't.


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    Re: Bye Bye Payton Henson

    Postby winwave » Fri May 08, 2015 1:14 pm

    tpstulane wrote:
      winwave wrote:
      tpstulane wrote:
      winwave wrote:
      tpstulane wrote:
      jonathanjoseph wrote:
      tpstulane wrote:
      Profoundwizard wrote:Anyone still think this was about Payton's AAU coach trying to get paid?

      Of course not. I said only the better players. He didn't even start for us. He saw the writing on the wall with the freshman coming in and left while he still had two years to get some PT. He wasn't going to get the PT he thought he deserved here.


      Which player coming in is a stretch 4? Or even a regular 4? None of the incoming players have his skill set and Henson was going to see plenty of playing time.

      Y'all going way over the top on some of these recruits and their impact as a freshman. The impact guys are all wings (and Julien) and the other guys are pure post players who will not see the floor over Osetkowski. There is little doubt in my mind that the roster has a hole at both the 1 and the 4, the two positions hit by transfers to Henson, Pinckney and Stark. Julien will be thrown into the first at the 1 but I think we no longstanding er have a D1A 4 on the roster.

      6'7" Cam Reynolds will start In that spot. Henson only got more mins because Reynolds went down with season ending injury. I believe Cam got a medical redshirt last season so that bodes well for the future. He also brings the same experience as Henson had. His game is also better suited for uptempo. Henson was more of a set and shoot type guy.


      Reynolds will not start in that spot. If he does then this class will be a big let down.

      Well who then if not Reynolds?
      The one guy we are going to miss is Jay Hook and that's it.


      Paul or Oliver.

      We will miss Stark and Henson.

      As for your latest mantra about people not being happy w/the class it is meritless. Not one person has said they are unhappy w/the incoming class. Just b/c people want to discuss it doesn't mean they aren't happy. This site allows such discussion.

      Right. It also allows positive thoughts as well as the negative. People said we'd miss Tarrant. Stark filled in well as a CUSA freshman. Henson has never done anything that I would miss on the court. Like I said his experience may be missed with all the freshman we'll have on the roster. You can miss them. I won't.


      Except there haven't been any negative thoughts on the class. People upset about departures in no says anything negative about the incoming class. And yes I will miss them.


      It's the facilities stupid!

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      Re: Bye Bye Payton Henson

      Postby JerseyWave » Fri May 08, 2015 1:20 pm

      We are not going miss any of the departing members of the 2014-15 squad. We are getting a huge upgrade in talent. You can watch film on these guys on youtube. The difference is night and day. It is now Conroy's job to mold the talent into a winning basketball team. It is also time to end the attrition since he will finally have competitive basketball players on the roster. There is going to be an air show in Fogleman that hasn't been seen since the Honeycutt days and I can't wait to watch it.



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      Re: Bye Bye Payton Henson

      Postby jonathanjoseph » Fri May 08, 2015 1:36 pm

      tpstulane wrote:
      jonathanjoseph wrote:
      tpstulane wrote:
      I don't think people are saying that. On paper they grade out as the best class in 20 years. Until they prove it on the court it's just that. However look at our roster last year vs the other teams in the league. We didn't match up with the athleticism the top teams had. Osetkowski was only a freshman and he outperformed most of the upperclassmen. Having a former NC and NBA player on this staff is huge. The guy knows talent and has connections to deliver it. I think more people are happy about this class than are not. Nothing could be worse than how we collapsed at the end of last season after a promising start. We wore down as the season progressed. The talent just wasn't there to compete with the top of the league. If you complained about last season then you should be happy to see most of the guys gone.


      I think there are two different issues here. One is the recruiting class, which is a significant improvement from what we've seen previously from Conroy or any basketball coach under Dickson. That being said, we're only 20 years from having one of the top recruiting classes in the country, we need to get near the top of the AAC first. This recruiting class is a fantastic step in the right direction and I don't think anyone has suggested otherwise.

      The other issue is that quality kids like Henson are leaving. Irrespective of the recruiting class, this is not the sign of a healthy program. If players want to leave in these numbers what do you think is going to happen when schools without the bumbling idiot Rick Dickson start offering Shammond Williams more money and better coaches facilities (with a free microwave!)?

      The recruiting class is great, but Henson's departure will leave a hole on the roster as well as signals continued deeper problems with the program.

      JJ he shot 13% from 3 and in the 30's from the field. If that's what you call quality then you have very a low bar. We may miss his experience but that's all.


      I'm not suggesting those are good numbers. But those numbers skew downwards due to 1) youth and more important 2) the failure of the offense to get good looks for players. Aside from his FG%, the kid has talent and size and looks like he can play and contribute at this level. We don't have any experienced backup, or maybe even any backup, at that position. The staff wanted him to stay for a reason.

      His departure is a loss, both on and off the court, regardless of his FG%. There is no way to spin it as a good thing.



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