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DfromCT
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MicMan wrote:There are more strikeouts than ever, from the majors down. More pitchers throw harder. The game is about matchups and XBHs.
No argument. I also don't disagree that home run hitters tend to strike out more than guys that don't have much power.

But Tulane is striking out at a rate that is at least one standard deviation above the norm for NCAA D1 baseball. I was shocked when I compared our strikeouts to the 29 teams that have hit more HR's coming into today. Most had less than 200 to date (we had 266 coming into the game today.) We might be in the top (bottom?) 5 in the country in strikeouts.

Getting back on topic, the "Live Stats" from Sidearm stats is updating ahead of Graf's call on the WBRH live broadcast! 2-0 Wave going to bottom of 5th.

Roll Wave!


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DfromCT
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PUT IT IN THE BOOKS!!!

Tulane wins 4-3, clinching the weekend series. Tied for first place with UConn.

I don't understand why Jewitt sent France out to start the 9th, having thrown 120 pitches through 8 innings. Does he feel our bullpen is that bad, and that France has no future? This is how Billy Martin absolutely ruined the careers of a young and talented Oakland A's starting pitching rotation in the early 80's.
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Nice win. We got the series. Let's not be satisfied. Let's be greedy.
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DfromCT wrote:PUT IT IN THE BOOKS!!!

Tulane wins 4-3, clinching the weekend series. Tied for first place with UConn.

I don't understand why Jewitt sent France out to start the 9th, having thrown 120 pitches through 8 innings. Does he feel our bullpen is that bad, and that France has no future? This is how Billy Martin absolutely ruined the careers of a young and talented Oakland A's starting pitching rotation in the early 80's.
I queried Guerry on this issue of excessive pitches and he didn't think much of it. I just think it's taxing to go full bore like that.

It would be different if it wasn't 120 stressful pitches but....
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it's a bit excessive, but not uncommon in college baseball.
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JP pitched one of his best games. The insurance runs produced on the Witherspoon2-run single in the 8th were huge.
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mbawavefan12 wrote:
Profoundwizard wrote:
RobertM320 wrote:To look at it in the very simplest of viewpoints, name one POSITIVE that comes from a strikeout.

I can think of several positives that can come from a groundout or fly out.
There are situations where you need to put the ball in play.
When there's a runner on 3rd w/ less than 2 out, I'm all for putting the ball in play and trying to get the run in. Most of the time, the groundout or flyout isn't productive.

One positive about the strikeout is that it's not a double play
To insinuate that a K is ok cause it is not a double play is the most intellectually disgusting argument. To point out a home run by rogers as justification for our numerous K's is equally gross.
Sure some teams trade more k's for power, obviously. You asked how many k's were too many, I point out that in losses we struck out at a much higher rate, ur response is a singular Roger's HR. How's this captain caveman: "Strikeout bad, HR good." Again, the goddam HC says the K rate is bad, but hey Rogers hit a home run so who cares.
You may well be a wizard but you r far from profound.
Wheww... I don't even know where to start with this. You've done a lot of stuff in this post. Misrepresented my argument, all out lied about responses I made and insinuated that everything the Head Coach says is automatically a fact. The head coach can be wrong.
For instance, in the pregame show after one of the San Diego games in which Hunter Hope hit into an inning ending double play with the bases loaded, he made an argument similar to the one I made. He said that's a time where he'd have been much happier with a strikeout. So if it's a terrible argument IYO, when I made it, consider that the HC agrees with me when you take his word as gospel when he says the K's are out of hand.

I point out the Rogers HR and any other 2 strike HR as a reason the strikeouts are more acceptable. Those HRs don't happen with the conventional wisdom of the 2 strike approach where you shorten up the swing and just try to play pepper with it.

My response to your post about our strikeouts in the last 3 losses had nothing to do with Rogers. That was to someone else. This was my response to you "Strikeouts come with the territory when you have a team that's around the top 30 in the country in HRs."
Jake Rogers singular HR isn't the justification for all of our strikeouts, but us being one of the best teams in the country at hitting HR's the last two seasons goes a long way in justifying them.

You pointed out a 3 game sample size where we lost and struck out more. Small sample size and correlation does not imply causation.

Again, the goddamn HC isn't always right. Every belief he has about this game isn't going to be correct.
Last edited by Profoundwizard on Sat Apr 01, 2017 9:26 pm, edited 2 times in total.
DfromCT
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To argue that being one of the D1 leaders in strikeouts is acceptable is like arguing that it's better to come in second than first. It just isn't so. We strike out more (and considerably more) than the teams that hit more home runs than we do. Yes, a strikeout is rarely a double play. But it is also NEVER a productive out. Never. I was flabbergasted when I looked at how few strikeouts (compared to Tulane) the 29 teams with more HR's coming into today had. It tells me that despite our power, we strike out a whole lot more than we should. And it isn't a Jewitt thing. Last year we had well over 500 K's.

Looking at the big picture, the average D1 program going into the weekend has 170 strikeouts. Our Green Wave had over 250. That means we strike out over 40% more than the average D1 team. FORTY PERCENT is a big number of give away outs.

Based on your post above, I'm guessing you are Graf? If so, you come off one heck of a lot more informed when on the air than you are sounding in this thread. I really enjoy listening to Graf while keeping the "live stats" page open. But please don't argue that K's are simply something that comes with being a HR hitting team. The facts state that we do it a whole lot (like 20% or more) than teams that hit more HR's than we do.

And oh by the way: I love the touchdown call Graf issues when we're at home! ("Checkerboards!")
Last edited by DfromCT on Sat Apr 01, 2017 9:20 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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DfromCT wrote:To argue that being one of the D1 leaders in strikeouts is acceptable is like arguing that it's better to come in second than first. It just isn't so. We strike out more (and considerably more) than the teams that hit more home runs than we do. Yes, a strikeout is rarely a double play. But it is also NEVER a productive out. Never. I was flabbergasted when I looked at how few strikeouts (compared to Tulane) the 29 teams with more HR's coming into today had. It tells me that despite our power, we strike out a whole lot more than we should. And it isn't a Jewitt thing. Last year we had well over 500 K's.

Based on your post above, I'm guessing you are Graf? If so, you come off one heck of a lot more informed when on the air than you are in this thread. I really enjoy listening to Graf while keeping the "live stats" page open. But please don't argue that K's are simply something that comes with being a HR hitting team. The facts state that we do it a whole lot (like 20% or more) than teams that hit more HR's than we do.
No, it's nothing like saying it's better to come in 2nd than 1st. I believe we had more strikeouts than all but 1 team in the AAC last year. We won it anyway.
Nobody said it was a Jewett thing.
I didn't look at every team that had more HR's than us but the 10-15 that I looked at were around the 8.5 K's per game number. I'll concede that we should be closer to that number, but that's where we were last year and everyone was up in arms about the K's then too.

ETA: NO, not a Graff. I made a typo in my last post that I think led you to that assumption. Sorry. Will correct it.
DfromCT
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Profoundwizard wrote:
No, it's nothing like saying it's better to come in 2nd than 1st. I believe we had more strikeouts than all but 1 team in the AAC last year. We won it anyway.
Nobody said it was a Jewett thing.
I didn't look at every team that had more HR's than us but the 10-15 that I looked at were around the 8.5 K's per game number. I'll concede that we should be closer to that number, but that's where we were last year and everyone was up in arms about the K's then too.

ETA: NO, not a Graff. I made a typo in my last post that I think led you to that assumption. Sorry. Will correct it.
No worries, and don't take this argument personally! It's an interesting discussion and the couple of searches I've run have let me understand both the college and MLB strikeout trends much better. FWIW I also learned today that Billy Martin's 1980 Oakland A's team had an amazing (and in the process career killing for 4 or 5 pitchers) 94 complete games in 1980.

I thought you were Graff, because you said that the HC made an argument to you in a pregame show. I don't get to listen to the pre-game shows, but assumed (and we know what happens when one makes assumptions!) that Graff does the pre-game show! As I posted just above, the NCAA average is about 170 K's through an average of 27 games. That's a 6.33/k/game average. Tulane is over 10 k/game. That's a HUGE giveaway of the precious 27 outs we're given each game.
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Being an A's fan I remember how their 1980s starting rotation would pitch 14 inning games sometimes because Billy Martin had no faith in the bullpen. Let's hope relief pitching becomes reliable and soon
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They should move it up an hour. Rain coming by 3pm.
http://www.nola.com/weather/index.ssf/2 ... leans_news
Heavy downpours projected to arrive Sunday afternoon could drop between three and six inches of rain, the weather service said. For now, the weather service is projecting a total 4.62 inches of rain to fall on New Orleans.
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tpstulane wrote:They should move it up an hour. Rain coming by 3pm.
http://www.nola.com/weather/index.ssf/2 ... leans_news
Heavy downpours projected to arrive Sunday afternoon could drop between three and six inches of rain, the weather service said. For now, the weather service is projecting a total 4.62 inches of rain to fall on New Orleans.
Probably should have just left it as a doubleheader today. Its not like they didn't know the rain was coming. Of course this does give Solesky the extra day of rest since he pitched Tuesday. Maybe they should move it to 11am to be safe.
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torbida wrote:Being an A's fan I remember how their 1980s starting rotation would pitch 14 inning games sometimes because Billy Martin had no faith in the bullpen. Let's hope relief pitching becomes reliable and soon
Amen!

The 1980 team had a rotation of Langford (290 innings pitched/28 complete games), Norris (284/24), Keough (250/20) McCarthy (221/11) and Kingman (211/10). Langford was the oldest, at 28. None of them were ever the same. Ironically, their closer, Bob Lacey, got one start and guess what: he pitched a complete game! Billy Martin ruined some fine young arms while he was in Oakland. Today, it's rare to see a MLB pitcher take the mound to start an inning having already thrown 100 pitches. Jewitt has done this a number of times already, and these are younger players. I hope he doesn't end up with a bunch of dead arms by the end of April. The bullpen must get better or we're not going to have much left in the (pitching) tank pretty soon.
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RobertM320 wrote:
tpstulane wrote:They should move it up an hour. Rain coming by 3pm.
http://www.nola.com/weather/index.ssf/2 ... leans_news
Heavy downpours projected to arrive Sunday afternoon could drop between three and six inches of rain, the weather service said. For now, the weather service is projecting a total 4.62 inches of rain to fall on New Orleans.
Probably should have just left it as a doubleheader today. Its not like they didn't know the rain was coming. Of course this does give Solesky the extra day of rest since he pitched Tuesday. Maybe they should move it to 11am to be safe.
Yes. 11am would give more safe travel time to get home.
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DfromCT wrote:
Profoundwizard wrote:
No, it's nothing like saying it's better to come in 2nd than 1st. I believe we had more strikeouts than all but 1 team in the AAC last year. We won it anyway.
Nobody said it was a Jewett thing.
I didn't look at every team that had more HR's than us but the 10-15 that I looked at were around the 8.5 K's per game number. I'll concede that we should be closer to that number, but that's where we were last year and everyone was up in arms about the K's then too.

ETA: NO, not a Graff. I made a typo in my last post that I think led you to that assumption. Sorry. Will correct it.
No worries, and don't take this argument personally! It's an interesting discussion and the couple of searches I've run have let me understand both the college and MLB strikeout trends much better. FWIW I also learned today that Billy Martin's 1980 Oakland A's team had an amazing (and in the process career killing for 4 or 5 pitchers) 94 complete games in 1980.

I thought you were Graff, because you said that the HC made an argument to you in a pregame show. I don't get to listen to the pre-game shows, but assumed (and we know what happens when one makes assumptions!) that Graff does the pre-game show! As I posted just above, the NCAA average is about 170 K's through an average of 27 games. That's a 6.33/k/game average. Tulane is over 10 k/game. That's a HUGE giveaway of the precious 27 outs we're given each game.
I think we've cleared up the Graff issue. I said that he "made the same argument to me" when I meant "as me". Sorry for the confusion. I was not on the pre game show.
Taking nothing personally D! I'm enjoying the discussion, we're both being civil. All is well.

I don't see the strikeouts as giving away an out. The bunt is giving away an out. Strikeouts are earned by the pitcher just like groundouts and flyouts. I expect us to strikeout more than average.
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Yes, but we're striking out a whole lot more than average, and a whole lot more than other home run hitting teams. There's 27 outs in a game, and we strike out roughly 4x/game more than the average D1 team and about 2.5 times/game more than the 29 teams that hit more HRs than we do. Since we've been playing better, our strikeouts have diminished. I don't think that's a coincidence.
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JP threw his best game today. He was really on. As for the bullpen when Gillies came in I told those I was with that it was a mistake. He doesn't give up the walks that our others give up but he gets hit. He's been more lucky than good. To his credit though he did get the next two. All's well that ends well. We have not had that killer instinct in this situation. Hopefully the frustration of the situation we have put ourselves in will drive them to get the sweep tomorrow.

D- it's JewEtt not Jewitt.
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DfromCT wrote:Yes, but we're striking out a whole lot more than average, and a whole lot more than other home run hitting teams. There's 27 outs in a game, and we strike out roughly 4x/game more than the average D1 team and about 2.5 times/game more than the 29 teams that hit more HRs than we do. Since we've been playing better, our strikeouts have diminished. I don't think that's a coincidence.
Diminished barely, still over 9 per game in the 9-3 stretch. Over 10 is probably a bit much, we were pretty darn good at 8.5 last year.
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winwave wrote:JP threw his best game today. He was really on. As for the bullpen when Gillies came in I told those I was with that it was a mistake. He doesn't give up the walks that our others give up but he gets hit. He's been more lucky than good. To his credit though he did get the next two. All's well that ends well. We have not had that killer instinct in this situation. Hopefully the frustration of the situation we have put ourselves in will drive them to get the sweep tomorrow.

D- it's JewEtt not Jewitt.
Gillies is surely susceptible to the HR. He's one of the few guys that Jewett trusts right now.
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mbawavefan12 wrote:
Profoundwizard wrote:
winwave wrote:
Profoundwizard wrote:As one of the Jewett complainers that never called for anyone to be fired, I actually kind of feel vindicated by the last 11 games. My whole thing was that the players on the team were better than the performance during the 3-12 start.

Dude you were one of the very worst. Attacking people on both sites viciously if they didn't see it exactly as you did which was that the world was coming to an end. This is not an overly talented team and it lost critical parts from last year. It was never an Omaha bound group and as I have said from the beginning it was a fringe team for a Regional. You haven't been vindicated in any way . All that nonsense that strikeouts don't matter when they clearly do. That message is now resonating w/the team and we are doing better . Furthermore as others have said we are playing better but we aren't out of the woods yet. We haven't even won this series yet. Just own it and move on.
Attacking people viciously on both sites? You're #fakenews winwave.

In our 8-3 stretch, we've struck out 103 times. That's over 9 a game. It hasn't mattered because strikeouts really don't matter.
There's nothing for me to own. I didn't say he should be fired. I said that he should have them playing better. I was correct.
Once again nobody said it was an Omaha team either but keep straw manning.
In the three losses we averaged 12 Ks per game.
7 k's tonight. W, Roll Wave.
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Sunday's game....USF- 7 Tulane- 5
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Another bad start Sunday. Couldn't quite overcome the 5-0 lead.
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DfromCT
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tpstulane wrote:Another bad start Sunday. Couldn't quite overcome the 5-0 lead.
I believe we're now 1-6 on Sundays.
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tpstulane
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DfromCT wrote:
tpstulane wrote:Another bad start Sunday. Couldn't quite overcome the 5-0 lead.
I believe we're now 1-6 on Sundays.
Wow. I didn't realize that.
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