Yulman Stadium (Benson Field)

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Yulman Stadium (Benson Field)

Postby gbgreenie » Wed Dec 15, 2010 1:34 am

Sader 24 I agree with everything you said except one thing. Instead of an indoor practice facility this should be the Retractable Roof Stadium they discussed. Room is limited. We need to look at multi-use facilities. Turchin Stadium should have been a combination Football and Baseball Facility that could have seated 35,000 with room for expansion. With the artificial turf this would have been feasible and better use of land with the lowest cost. With the savings the Retractable roof would have worked also. It doesn't make sense to keep building separate facilities with one function due to lack of space. A stadium could have served all those purposes if constructed right. Who knows a 35,000 retractable roof stadium could have been used for Basketball, Football and Baseball. The Superdome was used for all three but was too big. But a smaller version for Tulane would have been a great idea if the University had someone like Dave Dixon with vision. Cost and land use this would have been a great project for Tulane's future to the BCS.



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Re: Vision lacking from the Administration(Multi-use Stadium

Postby sader24 » Wed Dec 15, 2010 3:33 am

The 2 most legitimate coaches Tulane has had in the last 3 decades(Mack Brown, and Tommy Bowden) have both claimed the Superdome as their best recruiting tool. From the time I was 4 all I heard was how our biggest recruiting tool was the Superdome.



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Re: Vision lacking from the Administration(Multi-use Stadium

Postby RWR » Wed Dec 15, 2010 7:17 am

There was never a plan for a retractable roof stadium. That came from the idiot Kaare. The other facilities are there to stay so we need the practice facility. Tulane football is the problem not the dome.



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Re: Vision lacking from the Administration(Multi-use Stadium

Postby gbgreenie » Wed Dec 15, 2010 2:00 pm

Totally disagree with you. We are missing the neighborhood walkup crowds we got with the on campus stadium. People walked to the game from local neighbor hoods not having to drive and pay to park. We also need to quit nickle and diming facilities and consolidate with the limited land. Folgleman could come down with a multi-purpose stadium used for basketball and football with a retractable roof. That would help basketball and football recruiting. The university would then have use of the Folgleman area for whatever it wants.



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Re: Vision lacking from the Administration(Multi-use Stadium

Postby RWR » Wed Dec 15, 2010 4:44 pm

What are you smoking? Have you looked at the size of the area? No way a football stadium fits where Fogelman is.



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Re: Vision lacking from the Administration(Multi-use Stadium

Postby JTLiuzza » Wed Dec 15, 2010 5:27 pm

He meant build a multi-use facility in the current "athletics footprint." Then Fogelman could come down with the site being used for some other non-athletic purpose.

There are a million different ideas as far as construction goes but, until the school commits to being good at football, what's the point?

If we've got at least 30k+ actual butts in seats at the games on a consistent basis then we're talking about significant parking and concession revenues being lost. Then either a renegotiation of the dome arrangement or a stadium of our own starts to make sense.

As it is now, how much parking and concession are we losing with less than 5,000 people at the game? Maybe 400 cars at $10/pop parking = $4,000? I don't buy anything when I'm in the dome because it's all too expensive and frankly I don't see people around me buying much either. What are they selling in the course of a game as far a concession, $15,000 worth tops? Call it $20,000/game for parking/concession. Give us 7 home games per season that's $140,000.

Chickensh!t money. Certainly not a revenue stream worth spending $80million or so on a stadium in order to capture.

Now if you start to put butts in the seats, that's another story. But this administration has clearly shown that putting butts in the seats is not a priority.

So what? Are they planning to build a stadium, move to it, THEN get serious about winning and increasing attendance? Seems like a stupid approach to me but then that's pretty much what SMU did and maybe all the pointy heads "think" alike.

Either way, given the status quo, I've yet to hear a compelling reason to spend all that money on an on-campus shoe box and move out of the dome.

Let's win some ball games, consistently, first and exhibit that finally Tulane is serious about putting a quality product on the field.



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Re: Vision lacking from the Administration(Multi-use Stadium

Postby RWR » Wed Dec 15, 2010 8:20 pm

No parking revenue to be made b/c there is no place to create the parking. People love to talk about the money we could make but never talk about the money needed for upkeep.

As for SMU the adm. did take the build it and they will come attitude even if we aren't serious about winning. They didn't draw much after the initial curiosity factor wore off. Then some alums got together and put up the money to pay Jones. We don't have any alums willing to do that b/c when they were students it was drilled into them that athletics wasn't important. Therefore it is incumbent on the adm. to pony up to pay for their prior sins that caused this mess.



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Re: Vision lacking from the Administration(Multi-use Stadium

Postby sader24 » Wed Dec 22, 2010 10:08 pm

From a strictly cost-benefit analysis, actually improving the football "PROGRAM" could be done way cheaper and way quicker than building an on campus stadium. The President and board possess the ability to improve this program drastically through their own actions within the year. No red tape, no neighborhood association battles, no massive money raising campaigns to come up with 60 million, no study after study after study. Build up the program and then decide whether to build a stadium or not. What is the ceiling of a football program that plays in a 25K stadium? Sun Belt? What big name school can we ever play at home in a 25K stadium? Vanderbilt is the only SEC school. That means to schedule a big name out of conference opponent we have to go back to the Superdome and hope the date is available because we no longer have a lease there or use it consistently. This means our biggest payday of the season would have to be back at the Dome regardless and even then we would have to pray they would give us the date. If you're telling me we're building a 50K+ stadium uptown then I'm on board, but our program is in shambles right now and it would be outrageous to build a stadium that big at this time. All I'm saying is make the easy investment in the program, build this thing over the next 5-8 years, get our attendance up over 30 and approaching 40K, get in a few bowl games, get in the top 25, and then start talking about a stadium that's big enough to schedule decent OOC opponents. 25-35K provides us with zero flexibility from a scheduling perspective and relegates us to small time for good. What has the new baseball stadium done for the baseball program?



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Re: Vision lacking from the Administration(Multi-use Stadium

Postby JTLiuzza » Wed Dec 22, 2010 10:57 pm

sader24 wrote:All I'm saying is make the easy investment in the program, build this thing over the next 5-8 years, get our attendance up over 30 and approaching 40K, get in a few bowl games, get in the top 25, and then start talking about a stadium that's big enough to schedule decent OOC opponents.


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Re: Vision lacking from the Administration(Multi-use Stadium

Postby gbgreenie » Thu Dec 23, 2010 12:20 am

Southerm Miss schedules big opponents with a 40,000 seat stadium. We could follow their lead. They upgraded their schedule and played the big boys. Because that is where the money is.



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Re: Vision lacking from the Administration(Multi-use Stadium

Postby RWR » Thu Dec 23, 2010 8:19 am

But our stadium would only be 25,000. That's the max number. No room for expansion. So here comes Millsaps.



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Re: Vision lacking from the Administration(Multi-use Stadium

Postby sader24 » Sun Dec 26, 2010 2:15 am

Maybe I'm crazy, but I'd like to shoot higher than a 25K stadium and a program on par with USM. We have more potential than any CUSA program with the exception of UCF. It's so frustrating to watch people think on such a small scale because it's exactly what Cowen wants. We can't grow a fanbase playing in a lego stadium against bad teams. If we don't grow a fanbase football and athletics are done. Think big. Do you realize we brought 25K to Memphis for the Liberty Bowl? You know how many people I know that were LSU "fans" that started following Tulane that year and went to Memphis for the game because LSU sucked that year? Alot. There are alot of people in this area that would support a Tulane team that won consistently. It makes sense to me to put everything into the program and build it and actually get an accurate view of what our ceiling is fanbase wise before we sink a ton of money into a stadium.



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Re: Vision lacking from the Administration(Multi-use Stadium

Postby Wavebacker » Mon Dec 27, 2010 12:53 pm

If it was me, I'd have done a multi-purpose stadium with football in mind first. Make a football stadium that can also accomodate Baseball. Now I know this would not be popular. The baseball stadium would be cavernous and you'd lose a little something in the transition, but Football is the straw that stirs the drink and an on-campus football stadium would do much more for TU athletics than a cozy Baseball stadium.
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Re: Vision lacking from the Administration(Multi-use Stadium

Postby NOLABigSteve » Mon Dec 27, 2010 12:58 pm

Wavebacker wrote:If it was me, I'd have done a multi-purpose stadium with football in mind first. Make a football stadium that can also accomodate Baseball. Now I know this would not be popular. The baseball stadium would be cavernous and you'd lose a little something in the transition, but Football is the straw that stirs the drink and an on-campus football stdium would do much for for TU athletics than a cozy Baseball stadium.

That, or at least have built T2 closer to Claiborne, giving us a little more wiggle room for something.

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Re: Vision lacking from the Administration(Multi-use Stadium

Postby Wavebacker » Mon Dec 27, 2010 1:15 pm

NOLABigSteve wrote:
Wavebacker wrote:If it was me, I'd have done a multi-purpose stadium with football in mind first. Make a football stadium that can also accomodate Baseball. Now I know this would not be popular. The baseball stadium would be cavernous and you'd lose a little something in the transition, but Football is the straw that stirs the drink and an on-campus football stdium would do much for for TU athletics than a cozy Baseball stadium.

That, or at least have built T2 closer to Claiborne, giving us a little more wiggle room for something.

Welcome Wavebacker!


Thanks for having me.

Yep a multi-purpose stadium would be great. maybe you'd have had an open end , Horseshoe-shaped stadium with a small baseball component at the end? Actually what I'd really favor is a 50,000 seat inflatable domed stadium like Syracuse's Carrier Dome. When that domed stadium is filled to near capacity it rocks. You're right on top of the football field and it converts to basketball and other events when not used for Football. That's the real model to follow.


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Re: Vision lacking from the Administration(Multi-use Stadium

Postby HoustonWave » Mon Dec 27, 2010 2:41 pm

Just reading the various suggestions on this thread underscores how completely devoid the Cowen administration is of anything close to strategic thinking. I don't think the Cowenistas have any idea what they are going to do next week--much less how to optimize the layout of our "land scarce" campus. As I've said many times before, any half-a$$ed company would have fired this Cowen management team long ago.


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Re: Vision lacking from the Administration(Multi-use Stadium

Postby jonathanjoseph » Mon Dec 27, 2010 3:08 pm

HoustonWave wrote:Just reading the various suggestions on this thread underscores how completely devoid the Cowen administration is of anything close to strategic thinking. I don't think the Cowenistas have any idea what they are going to do next week--much less how to optimize the layout of our "land scarce" campus. As I've said many times before, any half-a$$ed company would have fired this Cowen management team long ago.


Right, and this is why we can't let the Cowen-led group engineer something as important as an on campus stadium. Anything that Cowen builds that's permanent will be a disaster, given how clueless he remains of the big picture. A <30K seat stadium would be a disaster of epic proportions.



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Re: Vision lacking from the Administration(Multi-use Stadium

Postby Wavebacker » Mon Dec 27, 2010 3:35 pm

HoustonWave wrote:Just reading the various suggestions on this thread underscores how completely devoid the Cowen administration is of anything close to strategic thinking. I don't think the Cowenistas have any idea what they are going to do next week--much less how to optimize the layout of our "land scarce" campus. As I've said many times before, any half-a$$ed company would have fired this Cowen management team long ago.


I wouldn't be that harsh with Cowan. As the President of the University he needs to evaluate athletics and remain objective about it's role and importance to the school. I think he wants the best for TU but lacks the fortitude to make a serious commitment to athletics. This is the biggest issue I have with him. If we're gonna have a sports program, make football the centerpiece and give it all the resources necessary to be the best it can be. Building an on-campus stadium for the sake of having one isn't necessarily the best decision. See SMU. They built a great football stadium that was hardly filled until they made serious commitment to football. Cowan needs to do the same thing. Jump in with both feet and say " Tulane is gonna field the best damned Football program we can!" I would imagine a new stadium would be foremost in that plan. An on-campus stadium would be ideal but, for me, renovate Tad Gormley and make that our new home. That would seem like a reasonable compromise.


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Re: Vision lacking from the Administration(Multi-use Stadium

Postby JTLiuzza » Mon Dec 27, 2010 3:55 pm

Wavebacker wrote:I wouldn't be that harsh with Cowan.

I would. What exactly has he done that should insulate him from harsh, and I mean harsh, criticism?

Wavebacker wrote:As the President of the University he needs to evaluate athletics and remain objective about it's role and importance to the school.

Indeed. And his "evaluation" has produced a slimy, behind doors attempt to kill a football program over a century old. Then when he was caught red handed, he's allowed it to die on the vine as a result of deliberate institutional neglect. He also has a different idea of athletics "role to the school" than pretty much every other university president out there. Either they're all wrong, or Cowen is. You know my vote on that one.

Wavebacker wrote:I think he wants the best for TU but lacks the fortitude to make a serious commitment to athletics.

So he's just a well intended coward/incompetent? Is that the best we can do for a university president? Barney Fife?

Wavebacker wrote:Cowan needs to do the same thing. Jump in with both feet and say " Tulane is gonna field the best damned Football program we can!" I would imagine a new stadium would be foremost in that plan.

I won't say what I think about anyone who seriously considers that there is any possibility of this occurring. It's infuriating that there are fans who actually sit around and wait for something like this to come from this CRAP administration who have revealed their real intentions NUMEROUS times. And yet some are still in "cut Cowen some slack" mode. Keep sitting around waiting for the "big announcement."

Wavebacker wrote:An on-campus stadium would be ideal but, for me, renovate Tad Gormley and make that our new home. That would seem like a reasonable compromise.

Feck a stadium. It's all a distraction. We've got one of the finest facilities in the world available to us right now. Our football program is a disgrace. That's the problem. There is NOTHING being done about it. That's the problem. There is one reason for this awful, embarrassment that is Tulane football. One reason only. SCOTT COWEN. Until every alum and fan gets that in their head and actually makes some noise about it, NOTHING will change. The only thing the rest of us can do can patiently wait for his retirement and hope that his replacement is nowhere near the incompetent, slimy, lying, egomaniacal destroyer that he has PROVEN to be over and over again.

Rant over. Sorry for the occasional shouting.



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Re: Vision lacking from the Administration(Multi-use Stadium

Postby Wavebacker » Mon Dec 27, 2010 4:29 pm

1ndabag wrote:
Wavebacker wrote:I wouldn't be that harsh with Cowan.

I would. What exactly has he done that should insulate him from harsh, and I mean harsh, criticism?

The Review. Painful as it was. Was a necessary gauge of TU fan interest. It was needed to see just how serious TU was about Football. I don't necessarily blame him for the hires made on his watch. Finney, Dickerson, Toledo all have been on Rick Dickson. Canning Scelfo was needed after the way his season went. TU Women's BBall is still consistently good, Women's volleyball up and coming , Baseball built a new facility and went to the CWS under Cowan. It's not all his fault but he does need to get real about commiting to athletics. I think Post-Katrina with the state of the economy as is, this isnt a simple fix. TU lacks heavy hitter doners to supplement the athletic program. To divert funds from the school's primary mission of education is tough when the buck stops at your desk and you have to explain to academics why athletics must be funded. Now if he came from a heavy Pro-Athletics school and had the balls to do what we all want him to do, we'd laud him but I get it. He knows the Div-III model and bottom line thinks TU may be better off in that route. BUT as is he needs to commit to Div-I athletics. Lack of a commitment is due criticism, but I think TU can excel in athetics while keepings it's academic integrity. In Football we need more leeway and this is where he needs the harshest criticsim.

Wavebacker wrote:As the President of the University he needs to evaluate athletics and remain objective about it's role and importance to the school.

Indeed. And his "evaluation" has produced a slimy, behind doors attempt to kill a football program over a century old. Then when he was caught red handed, he's allowed it to die on the vine as a result of deliberate institutional neglect. He also has a different idea of athletics "role to the school" than pretty much every other university president out there. Either they're all wrong, or Cowen is. You know my vote on that one.

Yep I do and as distasteful as The Review was, I thought it was a healthy catharsis to seriously talk about whether TU was committed to athletics. Just looking at the product and the results, as an outside I too would say " Hey is this even worth it?" As a true outsider , Cowan could have led for the downgrading of TU athletics, which , as we now know would have rankled many in the TU community. But broaching this topic IMHO was a good thing.

Wavebacker wrote:I think he wants the best for TU but lacks the fortitude to make a serious commitment to athletics.

So he's just a well intended coward/incompetent? Is that the best we can do for a university president? Barney Fife?

Misguided. I feel he wants the best but is unrealistic about what it will take to be the best. I also think he knows the resources are not there like at other schools to do all that needs to be done. Add in the resources needed to recover from Katrina plus the current state of the economy and I think TU is operating under some difficult circumstances.

Wavebacker wrote:Cowan needs to do the same thing. Jump in with both feet and say " Tulane is gonna field the best damned Football program we can!" I would imagine a new stadium would be foremost in that plan.

I won't say what I think about anyone who seriously considers that there is any possibility of this occurring. It's infuriating that there are fans who actually sit around and wait for something like this to come from this CRAP administration who have revealed their real intentions NUMEROUS times. And yet some are still in "cut Cowen some slack" mode. Keep sitting around waiting for the "big announcement."

I don't wait. I watch from a perch like everyone else, hoping that despite the handicaps we have against us that we'll still manage to overcome them and have success. It's doable. This Mickey Mouse league we're in allows for success if you can get your act together and win. Tulane sports teams need to WIN first. Win and show people this is a worthy investment with tangible, positive results. Baseball did this by consistently providing a winning product that the school went and supported thru the years. It's the model that TU really needs to follow. Allow programs some generous support, allow them to thrive at their own pace and support them along the way.

Wavebacker wrote:An on-campus stadium would be ideal but, for me, renovate Tad Gormley and make that our new home. That would seem like a reasonable compromise.

Feck a stadium. It's all a distraction. We've got one of the finest facilities in the world available to us right now. Our football program is a disgrace. That's the problem. There is NOTHING being done about it. That's the problem. There is one reason for this awful, embarrassment that is Tulane football. One reason only. SCOTT COWEN. Until every alum and fan gets that in their head and actually makes some noise about it, NOTHING will change. The only thing the rest of us can do can patiently wait for his retirement and hope that his replacement is nowhere near the incompetent, slimy, lying, egomaniacal destroyer that he has PROVEN to be over and over again.

Rant over. Sorry for the occasional shouting.

Cowan. Dickson, the finger can be pointed in a few directions but I agree. The foucs needs to be at the guy at the top and for this I do feel perturbed that TU doesnt realize what they have and how great it can be if properly supported. It's particualrly disgraceful when Football is your major $$$$ earner and you know this. If you're gonna throw your eggs into a basket, it needs to be Football's basket. Personally I think Tulane could have an awesome Basketball program if a serious commitment was made to it, but it's clear many TU fans favor Football. For this Cowan needs to recognize that fact and support it like it should be. We could be TCU ! This fact really irritates me the most !!.
Last edited by Wavebacker on Mon Dec 27, 2010 4:47 pm, edited 4 times in total.


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Re: Vision lacking from the Administration(Multi-use Stadium

Postby RWR » Mon Dec 27, 2010 4:30 pm

+1(as to bags post).
Last edited by RWR on Tue Dec 28, 2010 1:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.



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Re: Vision lacking from the Administration(Multi-use Stadium

Postby jonathanjoseph » Tue Dec 28, 2010 12:58 am

1ndabag wrote:
Wavebacker wrote:I wouldn't be that harsh with Cowan.

I would. What exactly has he done that should insulate him from harsh, and I mean harsh, criticism?

Wavebacker wrote:As the President of the University he needs to evaluate athletics and remain objective about it's role and importance to the school.

Indeed. And his "evaluation" has produced a slimy, behind doors attempt to kill a football program over a century old. Then when he was caught red handed, he's allowed it to die on the vine as a result of deliberate institutional neglect. He also has a different idea of athletics "role to the school" than pretty much every other university president out there. Either they're all wrong, or Cowen is. You know my vote on that one.

Wavebacker wrote:I think he wants the best for TU but lacks the fortitude to make a serious commitment to athletics.

So he's just a well intended coward/incompetent? Is that the best we can do for a university president? Barney Fife?

Wavebacker wrote:Cowan needs to do the same thing. Jump in with both feet and say " Tulane is gonna field the best damned Football program we can!" I would imagine a new stadium would be foremost in that plan.

I won't say what I think about anyone who seriously considers that there is any possibility of this occurring. It's infuriating that there are fans who actually sit around and wait for something like this to come from this CRAP administration who have revealed their real intentions NUMEROUS times. And yet some are still in "cut Cowen some slack" mode. Keep sitting around waiting for the "big announcement."

Wavebacker wrote:An on-campus stadium would be ideal but, for me, renovate Tad Gormley and make that our new home. That would seem like a reasonable compromise.

Feck a stadium. It's all a distraction. We've got one of the finest facilities in the world available to us right now. Our football program is a disgrace. That's the problem. There is NOTHING being done about it. That's the problem. There is one reason for this awful, embarrassment that is Tulane football. One reason only. SCOTT COWEN. Until every alum and fan gets that in their head and actually makes some noise about it, NOTHING will change. The only thing the rest of us can do can patiently wait for his retirement and hope that his replacement is nowhere near the incompetent, slimy, lying, egomaniacal destroyer that he has PROVEN to be over and over again.

Rant over. Sorry for the occasional shouting.


+1. Excellent post.



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Re: Vision lacking from the Administration(Multi-use Stadium

Postby sader24 » Tue Dec 28, 2010 10:11 pm

Any Tulane fan who shows any support for Scott Cowen whatsoever supports the end of the football program whether they realize it or not. He should've been run out of town in 2003.



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Re: Vision lacking from the Administration(Multi-use Stadium

Postby IM42lane » Wed Dec 29, 2010 10:39 am

AGREED . . .


sader24 wrote:Any Tulane fan who shows any support for Scott Cowen whatsoever supports the end of the football program whether they realize it or not. He should've been run out of town in 2003 (after "the Review").


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Re: Vision lacking from the Administration(Multi-use Stadium

Postby HoustonWave » Thu Dec 30, 2010 2:08 pm

sader24 wrote:Any Tulane fan who shows any support for Scott Cowen whatsoever supports the end of the football program whether they realize it or not. He should've been run out of town in 2003.


Exactly. Cowen is a disingenuous liar. Otherwise, at best, he's just a misguided dumba$$. Either way, he's doing tremendous damage to Tulane--both in image and substance.


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