More Baseball Schollies?

[winwave]

There was an article in The Advocate today about women's gymnastics making a big push for two more scholarships. If they get them maybe baseball can pick up two. Still wouldn't be enough but anything helps.

[DfromCT]

There was an article in The Advocate today about women's gymnastics making a big push for two more scholarships. If they get them maybe baseball can pick up two. Still wouldn't be enough but anything helps.

The NCAA limits baseball to 11.7 scholarships and has strict rules about how they must be split over so many players. Other aid must be available only to the extent it is to the general student body.

[wave97]

There was an article in The Advocate today about women's gymnastics making a big push for two more scholarships. If they get them maybe baseball can pick up two. Still wouldn't be enough but anything helps.

The NCAA limits baseball to 11.7 scholarships and has strict rules about how they must be split over so many players. Other aid must be available only to the extent it is to the general student body.

Aren't there programs like Boston College baseball and Penn State men's ice hockey who have sugar daddies that endow scholarships and build state-of-the-art facilities?

[winwave]

There was an article in The Advocate today about women's gymnastics making a big push for two more scholarships. If they get them maybe baseball can pick up two. Still wouldn't be enough but anything helps.

The NCAA limits baseball to 11.7 scholarships and has strict rules about how they must be split over so many players. Other aid must be available only to the extent it is to the general student body.

No kidding. The point is if the NCAA allows women's gymnastics to get two more scholarships it seems men's sports should get two more and baseball would hopefully be the recipient of those extra scholarships.

[tpstulane]

Men’s Tennis has 4.5 scholarships while the Women’s Tennis team has 8. Probably go to
Men’s Tennis.

[DfromCT]

There was an article in The Advocate today about women's gymnastics making a big push for two more scholarships. If they get them maybe baseball can pick up two. Still wouldn't be enough but anything helps.

The NCAA limits baseball to 11.7 scholarships and has strict rules about how they must be split over so many players. Other aid must be available only to the extent it is to the general student body.

No kidding. The point is if the NCAA allows women's gymnastics to get two more scholarships it seems men's sports should get two more and baseball would hopefully be the recipient of those extra scholarships.

I don't see how women's gymnastics has anything to do with men's baseball. You lost me trying to make that connection. And if every baseball program got two more scholarships (which I don't see happening) how would that help Tulane in particular? 13.7 would still mean most of the team is paying a good portion of the $70-75k/year cost of attending Tulane.

[RobertM320]

The connection is obvious, D. Due to Title IX restrictions, you must offer equal numbers of men's and women's scholarships. So in theory, if the NCAA were to increase the number of schollies in women's gymnastics, they could also increase men's baseball by the same amount. Now the thing is, schools don't participate in every sport, so you'd still have to meet Title IX guidelines at your particular school.

In our case, do we even still have a women's gymnastics team? If not, then they would do us no good, unless there's another womens sport that we're not fully filling the scholarships. Raising the cap on baseball to 13.7 would allow us to add two in baseball, and two in some other womens sport. That's a 17% increase in available money for baseball. That's significant.

[mbawavefan12]

What is the thought process in limiting scholarships? Especially in baseball to a number that is legit less than half of the necessary roster size? Then on top of that they also restrict transfer rules forcing a kid to basically pay his own way for a year if he wants to transfer.

Wouldn’t the NCAA charter be guiding them to provide more affordable options to provide better access so kids have choices and/or not saddled with huge debt? If schools don’t want to utilize the schollies then that’s their choice.

[tpstulane]

The connection is obvious, D. Due to Title IX restrictions, you must offer equal numbers of men's and women's scholarships. So in theory, if the NCAA were to increase the number of schollies in women's gymnastics, they could also increase men's baseball by the same amount. Now the thing is, schools don't participate in every sport, so you'd still have to meet Title IX guidelines at your particular school.

In our case, do we even still have a women's gymnastics team? If not, then they would do us no good, unless there's another womens sport that we're not fully filling the scholarships. Raising the cap on baseball to 13.7 would allow us to add two in baseball, and two in some other womens sport. That's a 17% increase in available money for baseball. That's significant.

I was about to post something similar. However It’s also based on the % of female students that attend your university. Unfortunately Tulane is almost 60% female at this time. So that means the athletic spread has to favor women by a similar % at a school like Tulane. So technically there should be more women’s athletic scholarships at Tulane than a 50/50 gender ratio school.

Tulane’s website: Tulane University has a total undergraduate enrollment of 6,571, with a gender distribution of 41 percent male students and 59 percent female students.

[winwave]

The connection is obvious, D. Due to Title IX restrictions, you must offer equal numbers of men's and women's scholarships. So in theory, if the NCAA were to increase the number of schollies in women's gymnastics, they could also increase men's baseball by the same amount. Now the thing is, schools don't participate in every sport, so you'd still have to meet Title IX guidelines at your particular school.

In our case, do we even still have a women's gymnastics team? If not, then they would do us no good, unless there's another womens sport that we're not fully filling the scholarships. Raising the cap on baseball to 13.7 would allow us to add two in baseball, and two in some other womens sport. That's a 17% increase in available money for baseball. That's significant.

This.

[winwave]

The connection is obvious, D. Due to Title IX restrictions, you must offer equal numbers of men's and women's scholarships. So in theory, if the NCAA were to increase the number of schollies in women's gymnastics, they could also increase men's baseball by the same amount. Now the thing is, schools don't participate in every sport, so you'd still have to meet Title IX guidelines at your particular school.

In our case, do we even still have a women's gymnastics team? If not, then they would do us no good, unless there's another womens sport that we're not fully filling the scholarships. Raising the cap on baseball to 13.7 would allow us to add two in baseball, and two in some other womens sport. That's a 17% increase in available money for baseball. That's significant.

I was about to post something similar. However It’s also based on the % of female students that attend your university. Unfortunately Tulane is almost 60% female at this time. So that means the athletic spread has to favor women by a similar % at a school like Tulane. So technically there should be more women’s athletic scholarships at Tulane than a 50/50 gender ratio school.

Tulane’s website: Tulane University has a total undergraduate enrollment of 6,571, with a gender distribution of 41 percent male students and 59 percent female students.

That's been put out there before about the % supposedly playing a role but it clearly doesn't. If it did then you'd have different scholarship amounts at all schools and we know that's not the case. So the rules may read that way but it's not the reality of the situation.

[tpstulane]

The connection is obvious, D. Due to Title IX restrictions, you must offer equal numbers of men's and women's scholarships. So in theory, if the NCAA were to increase the number of schollies in women's gymnastics, they could also increase men's baseball by the same amount. Now the thing is, schools don't participate in every sport, so you'd still have to meet Title IX guidelines at your particular school.

In our case, do we even still have a women's gymnastics team? If not, then they would do us no good, unless there's another womens sport that we're not fully filling the scholarships. Raising the cap on baseball to 13.7 would allow us to add two in baseball, and two in some other womens sport. That's a 17% increase in available money for baseball. That's significant.

I was about to post something similar. However It’s also based on the % of female students that attend your university. Unfortunately Tulane is almost 60% female at this time. So that means the athletic spread has to favor women by a similar % at a school like Tulane. So technically there should be more women’s athletic scholarships at Tulane than a 50/50 gender ratio school.

Tulane’s website: Tulane University has a total undergraduate enrollment of 6,571, with a gender distribution of 41 percent male students and 59 percent female students.

That's been put out there before about the % supposedly playing a role but it clearly doesn't. If it did then you'd have different scholarship amounts at all schools and we know that's not the case. So the rules may read that way but it's not the reality of the situation.

No. It’s the reason we don’t have another men’s sport like men’s golf. That’s when it comes into play. We brought in sailing and its coed but it has more females than males. It may allow men’s golf at some point in the future.

[Houma de Wave]

There was an article in The Advocate today about women's gymnastics making a big push for two more scholarships. If they get them maybe baseball can pick up two. Still wouldn't be enough but anything helps.

The NCAA limits baseball to 11.7 scholarships and has strict rules about how they must be split over so many players. Other aid must be available only to the extent it is to the general student body.

No kidding. The point is if the NCAA allows women's gymnastics to get two more scholarships it seems men's sports should get two more and baseball would hopefully be the recipient of those extra scholarshi

This should be absolute.

[HoustonWave]

As a private institution, is there any reason that Tulane couldn't simply reduce the tuition for any particular student? including any non-scholarship or partial-scholarship athletes? While there are NCAA formulas that have to be complied with when it comes to the granting of scholarships--but are there any similar restrictions when it comes to tuitions? I can see where state universities might not have such flexibility regarding tuitions, but it would seem private universities could do whatever they deem to be in their best interest, when it comes to tuitions. It would seem that this might be one way that private universities could mitigate the inherent disadvantage that their high tuitions pose--since the NCAA seems to have no interest in considering the different tuition levels that universities have. A singular focus on scholarships is just half the equation.

[wave97]

As a private institution, is there any reason that Tulane couldn't simply reduce the tuition for any particular student? including any non-scholarship or partial-scholarship athletes? While there are NCAA formulas that have to be complied with when it comes to the granting of scholarships--but are there any similar restrictions when it comes to tuitions? I can see where state universities might not have such flexibility regarding tuitions, but it would seem private universities could do whatever they deem to be in their best interest, when it comes to tuitions. It would seem that this might be one way that private universities could mitigate the inherent disadvantage that their high tuitions pose--since the NCAA seems to have no interest in considering the different tuition levels that universities have. A singular focus on scholarships is just half the equation.

Why couldn't non-scholly athletes spend the off-season working dilligently at jobs that pay something similar to a years tuition. Jerry Tarkanian, we miss you dearly....

[golfnut69]

The connection is obvious, D. Due to Title IX restrictions, you must offer equal numbers of men's and women's scholarships. So in theory, if the NCAA were to increase the number of schollies in women's gymnastics, they could also increase men's baseball by the same amount. Now the thing is, schools don't participate in every sport, so you'd still have to meet Title IX guidelines at your particular school.

In our case, do we even still have a women's gymnastics team? If not, then they would do us no good, unless there's another womens sport that we're not fully filling the scholarships. Raising the cap on baseball to 13.7 would allow us to add two in baseball, and two in some other womens sport. That's a 17% increase in available money for baseball. That's significant.

I was about to post something similar. However It’s also based on the % of female students that attend your university. Unfortunately Tulane is almost 60% female at this time. So that means the athletic spread has to favor women by a similar % at a school like Tulane. So technically there should be more women’s athletic scholarships at Tulane than a 50/50 gender ratio school.

Tulane’s website: Tulane University has a total undergraduate enrollment of 6,571, with a gender distribution of 41 percent male students and 59 percent female students.

That's been put out there before about the % supposedly playing a role but it clearly doesn't. If it did then you'd have different scholarship amounts at all schools and we know that's not the case. So the rules may read that way but it's not the reality of the situation.

No. It’s the reason we don’t have another men’s sport like men’s golf. That’s when it comes into play. We brought in sailing and its coed but it has more females than males. It may allow men’s golf at some point in the future.

per the Tulane website, there is a Co-Ed and a Female Sailing Team

[HoustonWave]

As a private institution, is there any reason that Tulane couldn't simply reduce the tuition for any particular student? including any non-scholarship or partial-scholarship athletes? While there are NCAA formulas that have to be complied with when it comes to the granting of scholarships--but are there any similar restrictions when it comes to tuitions? I can see where state universities might not have such flexibility regarding tuitions, but it would seem private universities could do whatever they deem to be in their best interest, when it comes to tuitions. It would seem that this might be one way that private universities could mitigate the inherent disadvantage that their high tuitions pose--since the NCAA seems to have no interest in considering the different tuition levels that universities have. A singular focus on scholarships is just half the equation.

Why couldn't non-scholly athletes spend the off-season working dilligently at jobs that pay something similar to a years tuition. Jerry Tarkanian, we miss you dearly....

Tark The Shark arranged high paying jobs to put auto and spending money in his players’ pockets, with no connection to scholarship or tuition activity. Tulane has already had campaigns for donations aimed at tuition relief for specific students. So why not tuition relief, with or without related donations, for baseball players?

[mbawavefan12]

As a private institution, is there any reason that Tulane couldn't simply reduce the tuition for any particular student? including any non-scholarship or partial-scholarship athletes? While there are NCAA formulas that have to be complied with when it comes to the granting of scholarships--but are there any similar restrictions when it comes to tuitions? I can see where state universities might not have such flexibility regarding tuitions, but it would seem private universities could do whatever they deem to be in their best interest, when it comes to tuitions. It would seem that this might be one way that private universities could mitigate the inherent disadvantage that their high tuitions pose--since the NCAA seems to have no interest in considering the different tuition levels that universities have. A singular focus on scholarships is just half the equation.

Why couldn't non-scholly athletes spend the off-season working dilligently at jobs that pay something similar to a years tuition. Jerry Tarkanian, we miss you dearly....

Tark The Shark arranged high paying jobs to put auto and spending money in his players’ pockets, with no connection to scholarship or tuition activity. Tulane has already had campaigns for donations aimed at tuition relief for specific students. So why not tuition relief, with or without related donations, for baseball players?

Cause it would count against the 11.7. You can’t just give outside money to circumvent scholarship limits. This is why so many SEC schools try to fight TOPPS not counting. I am not even sure if some need or academic aid is sometimes included in the 11.7. I do know the scholarship ls handed out by LA politicians to TU students don’t count.

[HoustonWave]

As a private institution, is there any reason that Tulane couldn't simply reduce the tuition for any particular student? including any non-scholarship or partial-scholarship athletes? While there are NCAA formulas that have to be complied with when it comes to the granting of scholarships--but are there any similar restrictions when it comes to tuitions? I can see where state universities might not have such flexibility regarding tuitions, but it would seem private universities could do whatever they deem to be in their best interest, when it comes to tuitions. It would seem that this might be one way that private universities could mitigate the inherent disadvantage that their high tuitions pose--since the NCAA seems to have no interest in considering the different tuition levels that universities have. A singular focus on scholarships is just half the equation.

Why couldn't non-scholly athletes spend the off-season working dilligently at jobs that pay something similar to a years tuition. Jerry Tarkanian, we miss you dearly....

Tark The Shark arranged high paying jobs to put auto and spending money in his players’ pockets, with no connection to scholarship or tuition activity. Tulane has already had campaigns for donations aimed at tuition relief for specific students. So why not tuition relief, with or without related donations, for baseball players?

Cause it would count against the 11.7. You can’t just give outside money to circumvent scholarship limits. This is why so many SEC schools try to fight TOPPS not counting. I am not even sure if some need or academic aid is sometimes included in the 11.7. I do know the scholarship ls handed out by LA politicians to TU students don’t count.

TOPPS is one more example of how the system has holes. I wouldn't suggest that we tie specific donations to specific tuition relief. But I would suggest that Tulane provide tuition relief for athletes that can't have a full scholarship because of the NCAA's arbitrary limits. It's the only way to solve the tuition disadvantage that, and other private schools have. Particularly given that scholarships are just a journal entry on the books of a university, and letting another few students sit in on classes hardly erodes the university's academic status.

[mbawavefan12]

As a private institution, is there any reason that Tulane couldn't simply reduce the tuition for any particular student? including any non-scholarship or partial-scholarship athletes? While there are NCAA formulas that have to be complied with when it comes to the granting of scholarships--but are there any similar restrictions when it comes to tuitions? I can see where state universities might not have such flexibility regarding tuitions, but it would seem private universities could do whatever they deem to be in their best interest, when it comes to tuitions. It would seem that this might be one way that private universities could mitigate the inherent disadvantage that their high tuitions pose--since the NCAA seems to have no interest in considering the different tuition levels that universities have. A singular focus on scholarships is just half the equation.

Why couldn't non-scholly athletes spend the off-season working dilligently at jobs that pay something similar to a years tuition. Jerry Tarkanian, we miss you dearly....

Tark The Shark arranged high paying jobs to put auto and spending money in his players’ pockets, with no connection to scholarship or tuition activity. Tulane has already had campaigns for donations aimed at tuition relief for specific students. So why not tuition relief, with or without related donations, for baseball players?

Cause it would count against the 11.7. You can’t just give outside money to circumvent scholarship limits. This is why so many SEC schools try to fight TOPPS not counting. I am not even sure if some need or academic aid is sometimes included in the 11.7. I do know the scholarship ls handed out by LA politicians to TU students don’t count.

TOPPS is one more example of how the system has holes. I wouldn't suggest that we tie specific donations to specific tuition relief. But I would suggest that Tulane provide tuition relief for athletes that can't have a full scholarship because of the NCAA's arbitrary limits. It's the only way to solve the tuition disadvantage that, and other private schools have. Particularly given that scholarships are just a journal entry on the books of a university, and letting another few students sit in on classes hardly erodes the university's academic status.

I wish they could but you have to apply the same relief to all students. Why I don’t know the spirit of the rule. The university can deem a student exceptional in a wide amount of categories and provide academic aid but athletics have a set limit. I was lucky to get full tuition to TU. I had a pretty solid background but I met some friends with say higher gmat scores yet much lower academic packages. It’s all a guessing game.

[DfromCT]

I still don't see women's gymnastics adding scholarships affecting men's baseball. Unless it's granted to ALL D1 schools, 11.7 will remain the number for men's baseball. We could triple the scholarships for bowling, and that, too wouldn't change the rule for baseball. We could add women's softball soccer, and that wouldn't affect baseball. It would only change the total number of scholarships available, not change a rule particular to the sport of baseball.

I think the initial premise of this thread was a big reach and whether granted or not the amount of scholarships for gymnastics will have zero affect on men's baseball. Yes, there's title IX, but that lacks a clause that says "adding scholarships to a women's sport means Universities have the right to add scholarships to a men's sport at will."

And BTW: Tark didn't have all his players employed making money to offset lack of scholarships. He had one player (Greg Anthony) who RENEGED his scholarship because his own T-Shirt business generated more revenue that the value of the scholarship. It was a guard at the height of the Tark reign in Vegas. Others got shut down by the NCAA, including a big name player who was re-selling sneakers that were provided by UNLV and some that he bought/sold.

There's rules about jobs for jocks. You cannot get a job watching the sprinklers turn on and off that ended 40+ years ago.

[winwave]

The thread was just meant to create discussion on a topic dear to our hearts. Wasn't saying it was an absolute. Hence the ? mark in the title. Lighten up.

[DfromCT]

I'm not losing sleep over it, as I'm just back to CT from California. Again, I don't see the connection or rule change affecting two entirely unrelated sports. Bottom line is, as much as Tulane fans and a very few others care about NCAA D1 baseball, it's the fourth, fifth, sixth or lower money generating sport, so the NCAA doesn't really care. The NCAA is about $$ despite their claims to a higher power calling to protect student athletes. It's all about the almighty dollar, and when there's only about 10-15 programs breaking even at 11.7 scholarships, they're not going to increase expenses. Women's gymnastics, IMNotHO, has ZERO to do with it.

[mbawavefan12]

I still don't see women's gymnastics adding scholarships affecting men's baseball. Unless it's granted to ALL D1 schools, 11.7 will remain the number for men's baseball. We could triple the scholarships for bowling, and that, too wouldn't change the rule for baseball. We could add women's softball soccer, and that wouldn't affect baseball. It would only change the total number of scholarships available, not change a rule particular to the sport of baseball.

Pretty sure people were just suggesting that if the NCAA extended the amount of women’s gymnastic scholarships (that would be enforceable for all wgymnastics programs) then they may also add some scholarships to a mens sport to even things out. Personally I doubt they would do anything in the event they decided to add female scholarships. That being said, until the power programs start to struggle in baseball, they probably won’t do anything.

[winwave]

Not hard to understand.