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Re: Houston Game 2Thread

Posted: Mon Feb 12, 2018 6:50 am
by tpstulane
winwave wrote:
tpstulane wrote:Guerry Smith:
More from #Tulane's Dunleavy: "I told the guys I'm not here to coach effort or toughness. I'm here to give you a game plan to help you beat these guys."


Sorry but these are college players and that is part of his job description. Shades of Toledo there.

Definitely NBA approach there.

Re: Houston Launches the Wave 73-42

Posted: Mon Feb 12, 2018 9:02 am
by galvezwave
I like what MD has done so far. And we have some nice recruits coming in. But I don't understand why he's not recruiting what we need to solve our problems that he himself acknowledges. How is bringing in more perimeter players making us tougher in the paint?

Re: Houston Game 2Thread

Posted: Mon Feb 12, 2018 9:58 am
by Show Me
winwave wrote:
tpstulane wrote:Guerry Smith:
More from #Tulane's Dunleavy: "I told the guys I'm not here to coach effort or toughness. I'm here to give you a game plan to help you beat these guys."


Sorry but these are college players and that is part of his job description. Shades of Toledo there.

I have to defend Dunleavy here. Throwing players under the bus? Otherwise there’s no comparison. He short handed and is doing the best with what he has. Now if he can’t recruit then all bets are off. What started off as a promising season has turned into the typical Tulane ugly finish. The team peaked with wins over SMU and Houston and have regressed ever since.

Re: Houston Game 2Thread

Posted: Mon Feb 12, 2018 10:00 am
by Show Me
tpstulane wrote:
winwave wrote:
tpstulane wrote:Guerry Smith:
More from #Tulane's Dunleavy: "I told the guys I'm not here to coach effort or toughness. I'm here to give you a game plan to help you beat these guys."


Sorry but these are college players and that is part of his job description. Shades of Toledo there.

Definitely NBA approach there.

He’s still learning the college game. I guess he doesn’t see the need to motivate players. He prefers to treat them like pros. In some sense that’s good. I don’t think Houdini could have made much difference yesterday.

Re: Houston Game 2Thread

Posted: Mon Feb 12, 2018 10:31 am
by RobertM320
Show Me wrote:
tpstulane wrote:
winwave wrote:
tpstulane wrote:Guerry Smith:
More from #Tulane's Dunleavy: "I told the guys I'm not here to coach effort or toughness. I'm here to give you a game plan to help you beat these guys."


Sorry but these are college players and that is part of his job description. Shades of Toledo there.

Definitely NBA approach there.

He’s still learning the college game. I guess he doesn’t see the need to motivate players. He prefers to treat them like pros. In some sense that’s good. I don’t think Houdini could have made much difference yesterday.


Better a coach that can put together an actual game plan to win games, than a rah-rah coach who's clueless about what it takes to win. We're not playing with Kentucky level one-and-done elite athletes here who can win games on pure talent alone. There needs to be a plan. Everyone used to complain about Conroy that all the players did was pass around the perimeter and throw up a last second shot. Would you prefer that now?

Re: Houston Launches the Wave 73-42

Posted: Mon Feb 12, 2018 2:38 pm
by netshorty
I just don't see what some of you see in Dunleavy. I won't argue that he appears to be a good coach capable of improveling players individually, but I don't see any great game plans. We don't play good team defense. We don't play good team offense, especially against a zone. In fact I'd say we've implemented Conroy's zone offensive of throwing the ball around the perimeter and chucking 3s. I was extremely bullish on MD when he was announced. I was very frustrated last year when he took a 12 win Conroy team and turned them into a 6 win Dunleavy team. The marginal success this year to barely has been due to individual improvement, especially Frazier, which is credit to Dunleavy. But it isn't because of any game plan...

I understand this isn't a popular opinion, but we've bought into the coach's name more than recruits have. If his name was Ed Conroy, he'd be getting slammed. So his name (and thus experience) give us hope that there is a huge upside. That maybe he'll learn the college game. But at this point we'll have to be happy rooting on individual improvement (e.g. Frazier going in the first round) while watching the team continue to struggle.

Re: Houston Game 2Thread

Posted: Mon Feb 12, 2018 3:02 pm
by winwave
Show Me wrote:
winwave wrote:
tpstulane wrote:Guerry Smith:
More from #Tulane's Dunleavy: "I told the guys I'm not here to coach effort or toughness. I'm here to give you a game plan to help you beat these guys."


Sorry but these are college players and that is part of his job description. Shades of Toledo there.

I have to defend Dunleavy here. Throwing players under the bus? Otherwise there’s no comparison. He short handed and is doing the best with what he has. Now if he can’t recruit then all bets are off. What started off as a promising season has turned into the typical Tulane ugly finish. The team peaked with wins over SMU and Houston and have regressed ever since.


I was clearly referencing the throwing of players under the bus aspect of Toledo. We agree the comparison would end there.

Re: Houston Game 2Thread

Posted: Mon Feb 12, 2018 3:03 pm
by winwave
RobertM320 wrote:
Show Me wrote:
tpstulane wrote:
winwave wrote:
tpstulane wrote:Guerry Smith:
More from #Tulane's Dunleavy: "I told the guys I'm not here to coach effort or toughness. I'm here to give you a game plan to help you beat these guys."


Sorry but these are college players and that is part of his job description. Shades of Toledo there.

Definitely NBA approach there.

He’s still learning the college game. I guess he doesn’t see the need to motivate players. He prefers to treat them like pros. In some sense that’s good. I don’t think Houdini could have made much difference yesterday.


Better a coach that can put together an actual game plan to win games, than a rah-rah coach who's clueless about what it takes to win. We're not playing with Kentucky level one-and-done elite athletes here who can win games on pure talent alone. There needs to be a plan. Everyone used to complain about Conroy that all the players did was pass around the perimeter and throw up a last second shot. Would you prefer that now?


It doesn't have to be and shouldn't be either/or. A good coach both plans and motivates.

Re: Houston Launches the Wave 73-42

Posted: Mon Feb 12, 2018 3:53 pm
by ajcalhoun
netshorty wrote:I just don't see what some of you see in Dunleavy. I won't argue that he appears to be a good coach capable of improveling players individually, but I don't see any great game plans.

I just think improving is important.

Re: Houston Launches the Wave 73-42

Posted: Mon Feb 12, 2018 4:33 pm
by tpstulane
I must admit I drank the Green Kool-Aid. Very disappointed in the recent downturn that has occurred. I thought we’d win 7 to 8 conference games but that appears unlikely at this point. I agree that ultimately Dunleavy is going to have to recruit 4 star players like Perry did to have the success we all want here. We’ve seen enough of project players in the last 10-15 years to know that’s not the answer.

Re: Houston Launches the Wave 73-42

Posted: Mon Feb 12, 2018 5:07 pm
by winwave
Perry did recruit well but most of his players would have been 3 star guys. In the early years Perry had a great cast of assistants. A lot of that 3 star talent ended up performing like 4 stars.

Re: Houston Launches the Wave 73-42

Posted: Mon Feb 12, 2018 5:37 pm
by tpstulane
winwave wrote:Perry did recruit well but most of his players would have been 3 star guys. In the early years Perry had a great cast of assistants. A lot of that 3 star talent ended up performing like 4 stars.

Not sure. I do know we had the 8th rated recruiting class in the country one year. Honeycutt, Allen, Childs and Cameron and company.

Re: Houston Launches the Wave 73-42

Posted: Mon Feb 12, 2018 5:47 pm
by Wave755
tpstulane wrote:
winwave wrote:Perry did recruit well but most of his players would have been 3 star guys. In the early years Perry had a great cast of assistants. A lot of that 3 star talent ended up performing like 4 stars.

Not sure. I do know we had the 8th rated recruiting class in the country with Honeycutt, Allen, Childs and Cameron and company.

Perry Clark did have a few Parade All-American recruits if my memory for a couple of decades ago serves me correctly, and those guys would have been way above 3 star recruits.

Re: Houston Launches the Wave 73-42

Posted: Mon Feb 12, 2018 6:32 pm
by Pepper
Honeycutt was a parade and mcdonalds all American. He was definitely 4-5 star.

Re: Houston Launches the Wave 73-42

Posted: Mon Feb 12, 2018 7:15 pm
by DfromCT
tpstulane wrote:I must admit I drank the Green Kool-Aid. Very disappointed in the recent downturn that has occurred. I thought we’d win 7 to 8 conference games but that appears unlikely at this point. I agree that ultimately Dunleavy is going to have to recruit 4 star players like Perry did to have the success we all want here. We’ve seen enough of project players in the last 10-15 years to know that’s not the answer.


I agree, Tim. I was thinking we'd win 8 or 9 with an outside shot at 10. Then we reverted to form. We definitely need to step up the recruiting. As I recall, Perry had a couple of Freshman of the year in conference 2 or 3 years in a short time span. Kim Lewis comes to mind as well.

Re: Houston Launches the Wave 73-42

Posted: Mon Feb 12, 2018 8:47 pm
by tpstulane
Chris Owens who later transferred was also a Parade All-American and was a Top 20 recruit.
A Parade All-American who was a top 20 recruit for Tulane following a high school senior season in which he was named Area Player of the Year by the Dallas Morning News.

http://www.nba.com/draft2002/profiles/chris_owens.html

Re: Houston Launches the Wave 73-42

Posted: Mon Feb 12, 2018 9:24 pm
by winwave
tpstulane wrote:
winwave wrote:Perry did recruit well but most of his players would have been 3 star guys. In the early years Perry had a great cast of assistants. A lot of that 3 star talent ended up performing like 4 stars.

Not sure. I do know we had the 8th rated recruiting class in the country one year. Honeycutt, Allen, Childs and Cameron and company.


Right. Perry was here for 11 years though. I didn't say we didn't get any 4 stars but most were 3's that ended up playing above that.

Re: Houston Launches the Wave 73-42

Posted: Tue Feb 13, 2018 12:44 pm
by sader24
That’s a horrible quote from Dunleavy, he’s a college coach with 18-21 yr old kids, if he doesn’t think part of his job is to coach effort and motivate he’s got the wrong job. His job is to win games and that means doing anything it takes to win those games. Steve Kerr just let his team coach an entire game bc they were in a slump and he thought he needed to get them more engaged and motivated and he coaches the best pro basketball team in the world.

Re: Houston Launches the Wave 73-42

Posted: Tue Feb 13, 2018 1:28 pm
by DfromCT
sader24 wrote:That’s a horrible quote from Dunleavy, he’s a college coach with 18-21 yr old kids, if he doesn’t think part of his job is to coach effort and motivate he’s got the wrong job. His job is to win games and that means doing anything it takes to win those games. Steve Kerr just let his team coach an entire game bc they were in a slump and he thought he needed to get them more engaged and motivated and he coaches the best pro basketball team in the world.


I think the context and tone with which this message was delivered needed to be included. It could be that he was delivering it as a loud and clear message to the team that the effort they put in was totally unacceptable. That's the problem with tweets, emails, and other non-personable communication. You don't get the tone and context, so the sentences may mean something entirely different when spoken to a group of 18-22 year olds than it appears when printed on an internet screen.

Or, he could have just gotten it wrong. We don't know.