Melvin Frazier drafted 2nd Rd, 5th pick (35th overall)

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tpstulane
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Wed May 23, 2018 3:39 pm

Show Me wrote:
Wed May 23, 2018 3:29 pm
tpstulane wrote:
Wed May 23, 2018 10:31 am
DfromCT wrote:
Tue May 15, 2018 7:36 am
Has Ray Ona Embo opted out of the draft yet? Anyone know the deadline to do so?
No. Probably next year in Europe if the NBA doesn’t work out.
Wow. He’s never going to be drafted even next year. He needs to go pro now if that’s his dream.
Will be interesting for sure.


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Sun Jun 03, 2018 3:49 pm

Wavetime wrote:
Sun Jun 03, 2018 1:18 pm
Good article.

https://8points9seconds.com/2018/05/30/ ... n-frazier/
Thanks for posting. I’ve always said he’s getting drafted because of his defensive skills. Many posters thought because he didn’t dominate on offense or carry his team on his back he should come back to Tulane. He’s a rare find in that he can play shut down defense. That’s the skill set he can bring immediately to the NBA. He’s looking more and more like he’s going late in the 1st round.
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Sun Jun 03, 2018 10:42 pm

Except you never said that. On page 3 you talked about how you read scouts rated his defense high. But no you haven't been saying all along that his D was so good he that it was going to be the reason if he got picked in the first round.
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Sun Jun 03, 2018 10:42 pm

tpstulane wrote:
Mon Mar 05, 2018 2:52 pm
swampnik wrote:We still don't really know if Frazier is playing 100% from his injury.
I would have picked Melvin for 1st team AAC over Gray (though I love Gray's style of play too).
I read awhile back he’s regarded as a top 5 defender in the draft. He’s only recently been considered a two way player which has only helped his draft status. Many Tulane fans only seem to judge him on his offense. The NBA scouts love his wingspan and his defensive skill set. He’s like Top 5 in the AAC in 3 categories. Points 4th, FG% 3rd and Steals 2nd.
http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basket ... conference
Here it is.
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Sun Jun 03, 2018 10:46 pm

winwave wrote:
Tue Mar 06, 2018 9:58 am
Everyone recognizes his ability on the defensive end of the court. The reason people talk about his offense is because the bloggers are saying he's a 3 and D player and that that combo is making him rise up boards. Most disagree with that.
My response on page 3 . Fact is now that the scouts are involved all you hear Melvin talk about is that he's trying to improve his shooting. I hope he gets picked in the first round and I hope it helps our recruiting. The reality is the only way it will help us is if he is an impact player his rookie year. The clock is ticking on MD. If he turns out to be a project that goes to the G-League and in a few years is a defensive replacement it won't do anything for us.
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winwave wrote:
Sun Jun 03, 2018 10:46 pm
winwave wrote:
Tue Mar 06, 2018 9:58 am
Everyone recognizes his ability on the defensive end of the court. The reason people talk about his offense is because the bloggers are saying he's a 3 and D player and that that combo is making him rise up boards. Most disagree with that.
My response on page 3 . Fact is now that the scouts are involved all you hear Melvin talk about is that he's trying to improve his shooting. I hope he gets picked in the first round and I hope it helps our recruiting. The reality is the only way it will help us is if he is an impact player his rookie year. The clock is ticking on MD. If he turns out to be a project that goes to the G-League and in a few years is a defensive replacement it won't do anything for us.
Not a lot of rookies being taken in the mid to late twenties at best are impact players. So, I guess it ain’t going to help us.
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tpstulane
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Mon Jun 04, 2018 12:05 am

winwave wrote:
Sun Jun 03, 2018 10:42 pm
Except you never said that. On page 3 you talked about how you read scouts rated his defense high. But no you haven't been saying all along that his D was so good he that it was going to be the reason if he got picked in the first round.
Explaining WHY to someone else NOT you.
Not going to waste ounce of effort to argue again with you.
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Mon Jun 04, 2018 6:54 am

tpstulane wrote:
Mon Jun 04, 2018 12:05 am
winwave wrote:
Sun Jun 03, 2018 10:42 pm
Except you never said that. On page 3 you talked about how you read scouts rated his defense high. But no you haven't been saying all along that his D was so good he that it was going to be the reason if he got picked in the first round.
Explaining WHY to someone else NOT you.
Not going to waste ounce of effort to argue again with you.
THAT'S BECAUSE YOU HAVE NOTHING TO ARGUE. YOU NEVER SAID THAT. YOU SIMPLY POSTED WHAT BLOGGERS WERE SAYING. WHAT MYSELF AND OTHERS SAID IS THAT BEASED ON WATCHING HIM FOR THREE YEARS IS THAT HE WAS NOT A 3 AND D PLAYER. THAT ARTICLE MAKES IT CLEAR THAT OTHERS ARE NOW CATCHING UP WITH THOSE OF WHO KNOW WHAT WE ARE TALKING ABOUT.
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Mon Jun 04, 2018 7:15 am

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Welcome to gotula.net, where it's never too late to mention Tanner Lee, Andy Cannizaro, Lindsey Scott Jr., Rich Rodriguez, David Pierce, or, of course, Scott Cowen. You see, no horse here is so dead that it cannot be beaten just a little bit more.
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Mon Jun 04, 2018 8:05 am

ajcalhoun wrote:
Mon Jun 04, 2018 7:15 am
Image
The board has become unreadable. If our crappy teams haven't chased fans from this board, then these ridiculous attacks will.

By the way, how funny (or sad) is it that the trait that Melvin claims is his best, defense, is something Dunleavy doesn't even teach. Thank goodness we have a coach smart enough to identify that he'd be better if he could use his left hand.

And how funny (or sad) that we had a top 5 defender on a team that was terrible defensively. Can't wait to see the layup-fest next year.

I don't believe Frazier going to the NBA will help us one bit in recruiting. Winning will. Dunleavy has proven in 3 years of recruiting that his name doesn't mean crap in terms of recruiting. Sending one kid to the NBA that is a going because of his athleticism, freakish wingspan and defensive skills isn't going to be very influential, IMO.
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Mon Jun 04, 2018 6:06 pm

Ch 4 6pm Sports doing a feature on Mel including Dunleavy.
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And here's news about our other outstanding grad:
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Tue Jun 05, 2018 9:35 pm

tpstulane wrote:
Mon Jun 04, 2018 6:06 pm
Ch 4 6pm Sports doing a feature on Mel including Dunleavy.
Here’s the video if you missed it
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Tue Jun 05, 2018 10:47 pm

tpstulane wrote:
Tue Jun 05, 2018 9:35 pm
Here’s the video if you missed it
https://twitter.com/andrewdoak_wwl/stat ... 27943?s=21
Great piece! Thanks, t! :cheers:
Welcome to gotula.net, where it's never too late to mention Tanner Lee, Andy Cannizaro, Lindsey Scott Jr., Rich Rodriguez, David Pierce, or, of course, Scott Cowen. You see, no horse here is so dead that it cannot be beaten just a little bit more.
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tpstulane
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Tue Jun 05, 2018 10:51 pm

ajcalhoun wrote:
Tue Jun 05, 2018 10:47 pm
tpstulane wrote:
Tue Jun 05, 2018 9:35 pm
Here’s the video if you missed it
https://twitter.com/andrewdoak_wwl/stat ... 27943?s=21
Great piece! Thanks, t! :cheers:
Yes. Kudos to Ch 4. Very well done.
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Tue Jun 05, 2018 11:07 pm

Good story thanks for posting!
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Wed Jun 06, 2018 11:22 am

This will impact recruiting in a major way.
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Wed Jun 06, 2018 11:31 am

alumniwave wrote:
Wed Jun 06, 2018 11:22 am
This will impact recruiting in a major way.
That's been debated throughout this thread. I'm not sure it's really going to help, as his strongest point--playing D--is not anything that Dunleavy stresses. Dunleavy did improve his shot dramatically, but I don't know that Melvin going in the first round will affect our recruiting.

How do you think it will help?
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Wed Jun 06, 2018 1:48 pm

DfromCT wrote:
Wed Jun 06, 2018 11:31 am
alumniwave wrote:
Wed Jun 06, 2018 11:22 am
This will impact recruiting in a major way.
That's been debated throughout this thread. I'm not sure it's really going to help, as his strongest point--playing D--is not anything that Dunleavy stresses. Dunleavy did improve his shot dramatically, but I don't know that Melvin going in the first round will affect our recruiting.

How do you think it will help?
The same way it helped Bob Toledo when Forte was drafted in the 2nd round and became an impact player his rookie season.
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Wed Jun 06, 2018 2:01 pm

netshorty wrote:
Wed Jun 06, 2018 1:48 pm
The same way it helped Bob Toledo when Forte was drafted in the 2nd round and became an impact player his rookie season.
Scratching my head at that one. Is this sarcasm? Didn't Toledo get fired a couple years later, which would imply his recruiting didn't get any boost from Forte in the NFL?

I asked a legitimate question and was curious as to his (alumniwave's) response. I'm not dissing your post, just wasn't sure if you were serious!
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Wed Jun 06, 2018 2:11 pm

DfromCT wrote:
Wed Jun 06, 2018 11:31 am
alumniwave wrote:
Wed Jun 06, 2018 11:22 am
This will impact recruiting in a major way.
That's been debated throughout this thread. I'm not sure it's really going to help, as his strongest point--playing D--is not anything that Dunleavy stresses. Dunleavy did improve his shot dramatically, but I don't know that Melvin going in the first round will affect our recruiting.

How do you think it will help?
I think it helps in that Frazier had some clear holes in his game coming in and MD basically helped to make him a first round pick. That was his selling point from the start "come to TU and with my 50 years of Bball experience I will turn you into a pro". It also shows that despite what others may say, you can get noticed playing at TU. As for the Forte comparison, it really isn't valid cause FBall is just such a large roster with totally different body types and athletes across the roster. One great RB really only effects the RB position recruitment and does very little for the remaining roster. In Bball, you can sell to a PG that MD developed Frazier's game (particularly his shot) and in Bball a small number of high end recruits can change a program overnight, FBall takes a lot more than a few 4-5 star guys, if that makes sense.

Sure we can debate just how large an impact Frazier will have on recruiting but it is clearly a positive. Unfortunately, winning is the best recruiting tool and the team is losing it's top two players. Would have been nice to get another grad transfer to bridge the gap.
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Wed Jun 06, 2018 2:35 pm

Nice response, MBA, and very accurate, I would think. Not sure that Scelfo had a big boost when he had a 1st round pick in 2002 and 2004. But I hear what you're saying.
" For every alum, no matter where they are...I want a football coach that's going to make Saturday something you anticipate and look forward to." --Troy Dannen

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Wed Jun 06, 2018 5:32 pm

mbawavefan12 wrote:
Wed Jun 06, 2018 2:11 pm
DfromCT wrote:
Wed Jun 06, 2018 11:31 am
alumniwave wrote:
Wed Jun 06, 2018 11:22 am
This will impact recruiting in a major way.
That's been debated throughout this thread. I'm not sure it's really going to help, as his strongest point--playing D--is not anything that Dunleavy stresses. Dunleavy did improve his shot dramatically, but I don't know that Melvin going in the first round will affect our recruiting.

How do you think it will help?
I think it helps in that Frazier had some clear holes in his game coming in and MD basically helped to make him a first round pick. That was his selling point from the start "come to TU and with my 50 years of Bball experience I will turn you into a pro". It also shows that despite what others may say, you can get noticed playing at TU. As for the Forte comparison, it really isn't valid cause FBall is just such a large roster with totally different body types and athletes across the roster. One great RB really only effects the RB position recruitment and does very little for the remaining roster. In Bball, you can sell to a PG that MD developed Frazier's game (particularly his shot) and in Bball a small number of high end recruits can change a program overnight, FBall takes a lot more than a few 4-5 star guys, if that makes sense.

Sure we can debate just how large an impact Frazier will have on recruiting but it is clearly a positive. Unfortunately, winning is the best recruiting tool and the team is losing it's top two players. Would have been nice to get another grad transfer to bridge the gap.
The Forte comparison is valid. Football players like basketball players want to make it to the next level.
Forte, Losman, Rasmsey and King proved the same thing you mentioned. You can get noticed playing at TU. That didn't help much in future recruiting.

Your comment about differences between basketball and football is exactly what makes the state of our hoops program so discouraging. You need just one recruiting class to make a difference. But after 2 years (about to be 3), he can't get us to where we're just competing in the AAC? Dunleavy's lack of success his first two seasons is the reason it won't have any impact.

I agree with you 100%, winning is the best recruting tool. Having one kid go to the NBA isn't going to help much. More than 110 schools have a player on an NBA roster today. All can say they made xyz into a pro player. Dunleavy's 50+ year's of experience has been the most overrated aspect thus far. It hasn't helped with recruiting. It hasn't helped with game day coaching. And we could definitely debate how much impact MD had on making Frazier into a pro prospect. But yes, he did have some impact. More than say most other college coaches would have had, especially given the fact he's highly touted because of his athleticism, freakish good wingspan and defense? Probably not.
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