The 11.7 Baseball Scholarship Myth

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Article from Baseball America on the 11.7 Scholarship for baseball

https://twitter.com/baseballamerica/sta ... 3429740544
Last edited by chain gang x man on Sun Jun 25, 2017 7:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.


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chain gang x man wrote:Article from Baseball America on the 11.7 Scholarship for baseball

https://twitter.com/baseballamerica/sta ... 3429740544
Wow. Great article on the BS 11.7 scholarships for wealthy baseball schools. Rick Jones is quoted as well!
http://www.baseballamerica.com/college/ ... e-success/
Former Tulane head coach Rick Jones identified three keys he looked for while recruiting: That an athlete could play, pass and pay—with the last being almost as important as the first.

“In our sport, a young man doesn’t necessarily always go where he wants to go,” Jones said. “He goes to where he can afford to go.”
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It doesn't seem to add too much new information thought. Schools that meet 100% of demonstrated need without loans and flagship state schools in states with state sponsored scholarship programs that cover all or almost all of tuition at said schools (i.e. like TOPS) are at an advantage over schools that do not.
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Former Baylor head coach Steve Smith, who was dismissed after 21 years following a 23-32 season in 2015, saw this financial crunch when the university looked to expand its footprint while raising tuition to compensate for increased spending.

“Ten years ago, if I awarded you 75 percent (of a scholarship) you owed about $4,000,” Smith said. “Today, if I give you 75 percent, you owe about $15,000. So my situation, scholarship-wise, has been blown apart by Baylor’s increase in cost.”


Sounds familiar
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chain gang x man wrote:Former Baylor head coach Steve Smith, who was dismissed after 21 years following a 23-32 season in 2015, saw this financial crunch when the university looked to expand its footprint while raising tuition to compensate for increased spending.

“Ten years ago, if I awarded you 75 percent (of a scholarship) you owed about $4,000,” Smith said. “Today, if I give you 75 percent, you owe about $15,000. So my situation, scholarship-wise, has been blown apart by Baylor’s increase in cost.”


Sounds familiar
Very familiar. Coach Jewett has his work cut out for him. I hope he can manage to overcome the disadvantages of coaching at a extremely high tuition private with no help.
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A P5 conference HC told me that kids will turn down 65%+ scholarships to his school to walk on to a private school and pay $0 in tuition.
Tweet from Kyle Boddy, founder of Driveline baseball, about this article.
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tpstulane wrote:
chain gang x man wrote:Former Baylor head coach Steve Smith, who was dismissed after 21 years following a 23-32 season in 2015, saw this financial crunch when the university looked to expand its footprint while raising tuition to compensate for increased spending.

“Ten years ago, if I awarded you 75 percent (of a scholarship) you owed about $4,000,” Smith said. “Today, if I give you 75 percent, you owe about $15,000. So my situation, scholarship-wise, has been blown apart by Baylor’s increase in cost.”


Sounds familiar
Very familiar. Coach Jewett has his work cut out for him. I hope he can manage to overcome the disadvantages of coaching at a extremely high tuition private with no help.
Jewett will tell you every player he got to Vandy went free. Unfortunately Tulane is nothing like Vandy.
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Show Me wrote:
tpstulane wrote:
chain gang x man wrote:Former Baylor head coach Steve Smith, who was dismissed after 21 years following a 23-32 season in 2015, saw this financial crunch when the university looked to expand its footprint while raising tuition to compensate for increased spending.

“Ten years ago, if I awarded you 75 percent (of a scholarship) you owed about $4,000,” Smith said. “Today, if I give you 75 percent, you owe about $15,000. So my situation, scholarship-wise, has been blown apart by Baylor’s increase in cost.”


Sounds familiar
Very familiar. Coach Jewett has his work cut out for him. I hope he can manage to overcome the disadvantages of coaching at a extremely high tuition private with no help.
Jewett will tell you every player he got to Vandy went free. Unfortunately Tulane is nothing like Vandy.
+1000
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In late March, Stanford announced it was raising an important financial aid threshold. Previously, any family with a yearly household income of $100,000 or less could expect to contribute nothing to a student’s tuition payments. This year, that number became $125,000, which is more than twice the median U.S. household income but right in line with the median figure of Stanford’s student body
Read more at http://www.baseballamerica.com/college/ ... 3pXslcM.99

What is the threshold at Tulane and does the student get 100% tuition?
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chain gang x man wrote:In late March, Stanford announced it was raising an important financial aid threshold. Previously, any family with a yearly household income of $100,000 or less could expect to contribute nothing to a student’s tuition payments. This year, that number became $125,000, which is more than twice the median U.S. household income but right in line with the median figure of Stanford’s student body
Read more at http://www.baseballamerica.com/college/ ... 3pXslcM.99

What is the threshold at Tulane and does the student get 100% tuition?
80% is the highest Tulane will go on need based. And 80% is rare. And it only covers tuition. Not books or housing. The family's total adjusted gross income must be less than $75K per year.
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tpstulane wrote:
chain gang x man wrote:In late March, Stanford announced it was raising an important financial aid threshold. Previously, any family with a yearly household income of $100,000 or less could expect to contribute nothing to a student’s tuition payments. This year, that number became $125,000, which is more than twice the median U.S. household income but right in line with the median figure of Stanford’s student body
Read more at http://www.baseballamerica.com/college/ ... 3pXslcM.99

What is the threshold at Tulane and does the student get 100% tuition?
80% is the highest Tulane will go on need based. And 80% is rare. And it only covers tuition. Not books or housing. The family's total adjusted gross income must be less than $75K per year.
This.

The 2015 article below talks about need and it takes a close look at Tulane. Tulane says that meet generally meets 95% of need, but only 69% of the students -that applied and were determined to have need- had their need fully met. Looking at the chart in the article, only 75% of the 50% of the student body that actually applied for need were determined by the University to have need (37.5% of total student body was determined to have need), and, of that 37.5%, 69% of that group had their need fully met, or 25.8% of the total student body.

Basically, 50% of the student body applied for need, 75% of that group was determined to have need, and 69% of the group that was determined to have need had their need fully met and that translates to 25.8% of the total student body.

Remember that meeting 100% of need does not necessarily mean no loans, as indicated in the example at the top of the article. As a result, many students that have 100% of their need met by Tulane will also have federal loans.

http://www.thecollegesolution.com/schoo ... al-need-2/
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Aberzombie1892 wrote:
tpstulane wrote:
chain gang x man wrote:In late March, Stanford announced it was raising an important financial aid threshold. Previously, any family with a yearly household income of $100,000 or less could expect to contribute nothing to a student’s tuition payments. This year, that number became $125,000, which is more than twice the median U.S. household income but right in line with the median figure of Stanford’s student body
Read more at http://www.baseballamerica.com/college/ ... 3pXslcM.99

What is the threshold at Tulane and does the student get 100% tuition?
80% is the highest Tulane will go on need based. And 80% is rare. And it only covers tuition. Not books or housing. The family's total adjusted gross income must be less than $75K per year.
This.

The 2015 article below talks about need and it takes a close look at Tulane. Tulane says that meet generally meets 95% of need, but only 69% of the students -that applied and were determined to have need- had their need fully met. Looking at the chart in the article, only 75% of the 50% of the student body that actually applied for need were determined by the University to have need (37.5% of total student body was determined to have need), and, of that 37.5%, 69% of that group had their need fully met, or 25.8% of the total student body.

Basically, 50% of the student body applied for need, 75% of that group was determined to have need, and 69% of the group that was determined to have need had their need fully met and that translates to 25.8% of the total student body.

Remember that meeting 100% of need does not necessarily mean no loans, as indicated in the example at the top of the article. As a result, many students that have 100% of their need met by Tulane will also have federal loans.

http://www.thecollegesolution.com/schoo ... al-need-2/
Thanks for the update. So it's now it looks worst than I thought. And gross combined family income at or below $75K only starts the process.
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Don't confuse yourself with all the verbiage and statistics. All you need to know is that the Tulane administration will do the absolute minimum to support athletics and keep its conference affiliation. As a result, the overwhelming odds are that they will finish closer to the bottom in conference standings in the major sports than the top. Once you understand that, the angst of following Tulane athletics is greatly decreased. Look at it this way, Tulane is offering intramural sports for its students to get some sunshine, enjoyment and exercise out of their participation. Don't think of it as competing in any way.
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tpstulane wrote:Thanks for the update. So it's now it looks worst than I thought. And gross combined family income at or below $75K only starts the process.
Well, it really draws attention to what a great deal that Stanford offers - zero family contribution for incomes of $65,000 or below and zero tuition charges for incomes of $125,000 or below (assuming typical assets for the income range).

http://financialaid.stanford.edu/underg ... arent.html

Of course, Stanford has an endowment worth over $22 billion, so it can largely do whatever it wants. Tulane, in contrast has about 1/22 of that.
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Jaxwave wrote:Don't confuse yourself with all the verbiage and statistics. All you need to know is that the Tulane administration will do the absolute minimum to support athletics and keep its conference affiliation. As a result, the overwhelming odds are that they will finish closer to the bottom in conference standings in the major sports than the top. Once you understand that, the angst of following Tulane athletics is greatly decreased. Look at it this way, Tulane is offering intramural sports for its students to get some sunshine, enjoyment and exercise out of their participation. Don't think of it as competing in any way.
Good analysis. Fighting it out with Social Work.
And here's your proof:
Image
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Aberzombie1892 wrote:
tpstulane wrote:Thanks for the update. So it's now it looks worst than I thought. And gross combined family income at or below $75K only starts the process.
Well, it really draws attention to what a great deal that Stanford offers - zero family contribution for incomes of $65,000 or below and zero tuition charges for incomes of $125,000 or below (assuming typical assets for the income range).

http://financialaid.stanford.edu/underg ... arent.html

Of course, Stanford has an endowment worth over $22 billion, so it can largely do whatever it wants. Tulane, in contrast has about 1/22 of that.
Tulane must do a lousy job investing. Because it's endowment never seems to grow. I understand fundraising but the money already raised isn't growing like it should. And only 1% of Tulane's endowment goes to supporting athletics.
I'd bet other successful athletic programs give more than 1% support. So Tulane cares about 1% for winning in athletics.
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tpstulane wrote:
Aberzombie1892 wrote:
tpstulane wrote:Thanks for the update. So it's now it looks worst than I thought. And gross combined family income at or below $75K only starts the process.
Well, it really draws attention to what a great deal that Stanford offers - zero family contribution for incomes of $65,000 or below and zero tuition charges for incomes of $125,000 or below (assuming typical assets for the income range).

http://financialaid.stanford.edu/underg ... arent.html

Of course, Stanford has an endowment worth over $22 billion, so it can largely do whatever it wants. Tulane, in contrast has about 1/22 of that.
Tulane must do a lousy job investing. Because it's endowment never seems to grow like others. I understand fundraising but the money already raised isn't growing like it should. And only 1% of Tulane's endowment goes to supporting athletics.
I'd bet other successful athletic programs give more than 1% support. So Tulane cares about 1% for winning in athletics.
One of the professors that left Tulane for the University of Virginia after Katrina wrote a book that documented their life, and, in it, they asserted that Tulane's endowment isn't income producing and that is what is preventing Tulane from achieving the same level of endowment growth that other universities experienced or are experiencing. The professor also explained that public universities with large endowments that still received money from the state (i.e. the University of Virginia) were more desirable places to work than private universities with smaller endowments that had limited hope of ever catching up to either those types of state universities or the very wealthy private universities.

Because of the difficulty gaining access to information that would prove/disprove that assertion, it's hard to say whether it's fact or fiction. That being said, it makes at least some sense. Given that Tulane's endowment is around 1/5 (on average) of the endowments of Rice, Emory, Duke, WashU, and Vanderbilt, how could it ever just randomly add billions? Fitts announced a $1B+ fundraising plan when he was hired in 2014, but Tulane alumni haven't heard a squeak about that over the last few years.

As a side note, Tulane's endowment has been surpassed by quite a few southern public schools - University of Texas, Texas A&M, Georgia Tech, University of North Carolina, University of Virginia, University of Florida, and University of Oklahoma with quite a few other schools not far behind (University of Tennessee, University of Missouri, Virginia Tech, etc.) - and that ignores all of the non-super wealthy southern private schools that have larger endowments than Tulane like TCU, SMU, Washington & Lee, etc.

EDIT - misspelled "Fitts" as "Fritz"
Last edited by Aberzombie1892 on Mon Jun 26, 2017 9:20 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Aberzombie1892 wrote:
tpstulane wrote:
Aberzombie1892 wrote:
tpstulane wrote:Thanks for the update. So it's now it looks worst than I thought. And gross combined family income at or below $75K only starts the process.
Well, it really draws attention to what a great deal that Stanford offers - zero family contribution for incomes of $65,000 or below and zero tuition charges for incomes of $125,000 or below (assuming typical assets for the income range).

http://financialaid.stanford.edu/underg ... arent.html

Of course, Stanford has an endowment worth over $22 billion, so it can largely do whatever it wants. Tulane, in contrast has about 1/22 of that.
Tulane must do a lousy job investing. Because it's endowment never seems to grow like others. I understand fundraising but the money already raised isn't growing like it should. And only 1% of Tulane's endowment goes to supporting athletics.
I'd bet other successful athletic programs give more than 1% support. So Tulane cares about 1% for winning in athletics.
One of the professors that left Tulane for the University of Virginia after Katrina wrote a book that documented their life, and, in it, they asserted that Tulane's endowment isn't income producing and that is what is preventing Tulane from achieving the same level of endowment growth that other universities experienced or are experiencing. The professor also explained that public universities with large endowments that still received money from the state (i.e. the University of Virginia) were more desirable places to work than private universities with smaller endowments that had limited hope of ever catching up to either those types of state universities or the very wealthy private universities.

Because of the difficulty gaining access to information that would prove/disprove that assertion, it's hard to say whether it's fact or fiction. That being said, it makes at least some sense. Given that Tulane's endowment is around 1/5 (on average) of the endowments of Rice, Emory, Duke, WashU, and Vanderbilt, how could it ever just randomly add billions? Fitts announced a $1B+ fundraising plan when he was hired in 2014, but Tulane alumni haven't heard a squeak about that over the last few years.

As a side note, Tulane's endowment has been surpassed by quite a few southern public schools - University of Texas, Texas A&M, Georgia Tech, University of North Carolina, University of Virginia, University of Florida, and University of Oklahoma with quite a few other schools not far behind (University of Tennessee, University of Missouri, Virginia Tech, etc.) - and that ignores all of the non-super wealthy southern private schools that have larger endowments than Tulane like TCU, SMU, Washington & Lee, etc.
Thanks. Thought so. Unless something changes it looks like others will continue to surpass our endowment unless tons of new money is raised or a better investment management team is found.
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I nominate TPS for portfolio manger !!!!!...now, about those South American "Import - Export" cartels offering a high return on investment !!!
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golfnut69 wrote:I nominate TPS for portfolio manger !!!!!...now, about those South American "Import - Export" cartels offering a high return on investment !!!
:mrgreen:
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What's worse is the FY16 endowment report has this gem:

"For fiscal year 2016, the Pooled Endowment declined by 2.1% while Eminent Scholars was down by
1.5%. It is extremely rare for endowments to post negative returns in any fiscal year since their portfolios
are highly diversified by asset class and strategy and manager. It is of little consolation that only a
handful of endowments posted positive numbers this year, but underscores the difficulty of generating
reasonable rates of return in this environment."

https://www2.tulane.edu/tef/upload/FY16 ... Report.pdf
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For a University that prides itself on academia, they sure are dumb.
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Aberzombie1892 wrote:
What's worse is the FY16 endowment report has this gem:

"For fiscal year 2016, the Pooled Endowment declined by 2.1% while Eminent Scholars was down by
1.5%. It is extremely rare for endowments to post negative returns in any fiscal year since their portfolios
are highly diversified by asset class and strategy and manager. It is of little consolation that only a
handful of endowments posted positive numbers this year, but underscores the difficulty of generating
reasonable rates of return in this environment."

https://www2.tulane.edu/tef/upload/FY16 ... Report.pdf
It's called failing. They are probably in oil this year. :oops:
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It's not due to a lack of resources. According to the IRS form 990, the TU CIO earned $1.5 million in 2014. Plus the investment department is located in Darien CT.
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