ESPN subscriber collapse

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Re: ESPN Loses 4M subs in the past year

Postby lurker123 » Thu Mar 09, 2017 8:29 am

Show Me wrote:
lurker123 wrote:
Show Me wrote:Disney owns ESPN. They are not going to try to generate new revenue. They are going to cut expenses. Their other properties are making up for their ESPN flop. I wouldn't be surprised to see them try to sell it off. They also own ABC which is tanking on it Bowl viewership since the playoff was instituted.


What bowl games are on ABC? They have a large regular season schedule of CFB with declining ratings but I thought all bowl games including FBS playoff games were on ESPN but perhaps I am mistaken.

LSU was on ABC with the Citrus Bowl. The Las Vegas Bowl Was another I remember. Best to google the entire TV 2016 schedule to get the rest. Most were on ESPN but ABC did carry a few.


Thanks for the prompt response and answering my question. ABC carried a few while ESPN carried 10x more including the most important New Year's Day games and CFB playoffs. Real point is it doesn't matter at all what ABC's bowl viewership is whether boom or bust. It just needed New Year's Day program filler after showing Rose Bowl parade since it had migrated Rose Bowl and Sugar Bowl to ESPN. Disney will likely spin off/sell ESPN as you explain.



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Re: ESPN Loses 4M subs in the past year

Postby tpstulane » Thu Mar 09, 2017 8:56 am

Looks like ESPN has turned sports fans off with its politics.

Image


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Re: ESPN Loses 4M subs in the past year

Postby lurker123 » Thu Mar 09, 2017 9:20 am

TPS, Great find. Simple screen shot says it all. Makes me wonder how Olberman got fired? I guess cutting costs trumps political sympathies. (Sorry for the pun!)



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Re: ESPN Loses 4M subs in the past year

Postby mbawavefan12 » Thu Mar 09, 2017 9:54 am

tpstulane wrote:Looks like ESPN has turned sports fans off with its politics.

Image


Oh come on, OTL is a sports journalism program, that I don't watch much at all BTW. Literally everyone of those stories has some connection to sport.

"The first story covers Florida Senator", ya talking about how Olympic sports boards will change.

What a load of crap Sean Davis is......

I am no ESPN apologist but at least get the facts straight. Understand how OTL operates and actually look at the stories.



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Re: ESPN Loses 4M subs in the past year

Postby tpstulane » Wed Apr 26, 2017 9:11 am

Here come the layoffs
https://finance.yahoo.com/news/espn-wil ... 57142.html
The 100 people getting cut are all “on-air talent,” a label ESPN uses for TV personalities, radio hosts, and writers who regularly appear on TV and radio. (ESPN says it has 1,000 such people, prior to these cuts.)


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Re: ESPN Loses 4M subs in the past year

Postby anEngineer » Wed Apr 26, 2017 9:56 am

tpstulane wrote:Here come the layoffs
https://finance.yahoo.com/news/espn-wil ... 57142.html
The 100 people getting cut are all “on-air talent,” a label ESPN uses for TV personalities, radio hosts, and writers who regularly appear on TV and radio. (ESPN says it has 1,000 such people, prior to these cuts.)


What's really ridiculous is that there are 100 "on-air talents" to let go. How many people do you need to discuss a sporting event? Most, if not all, of these are opinionists and opinion is not news. Before the event they are all blathering about what should, could and might happen. After the event, the blathering is about why those same things didn't happen.



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Re: ESPN Loses 4M subs in the past year

Postby lurker123 » Wed Apr 26, 2017 4:04 pm

anEngineer wrote:
tpstulane wrote:Here come the layoffs
https://finance.yahoo.com/news/espn-wil ... 57142.html
The 100 people getting cut are all “on-air talent,” a label ESPN uses for TV personalities, radio hosts, and writers who regularly appear on TV and radio. (ESPN says it has 1,000 such people, prior to these cuts.)


What's really ridiculous is that there are 100 "on-air talents" to let go. How many people do you need to discuss a sporting event? Most, if not all, of these are opinionists and opinion is not news. Before the event they are all blathering about what should, could and might happen. After the event, the blathering is about why those same things didn't happen.


To be fair, apparently ESPN includes in the "on-air talents" category, the producers and go-fers who whisper talk in the ears to make the talking heads talk on air. It takes a village to raise a talking head or something like that....



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Re: ESPN Loses 4M subs in the past year

Postby lurker123 » Wed Apr 26, 2017 5:00 pm

For those who think Sean Davis is an ignorant tool here is a piece by ESPN Public Editor from several weeks ago.

http://www.espn.com/blog/ombudsman/post ... e-for-espn

Money quote: "The desire to draw a boundary between sports, culture and politics is a fool’s errand." In other words, I'm for giving you more politics not less on ESPN.

Just saying.



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Re: ESPN Loses 4M subs in the past year

Postby GreenLantern » Wed Apr 26, 2017 6:10 pm

Trent Dilfer and Jayson Stark are two of the more recognizable layoff victims:

http://money.cnn.com/2017/04/26/media/espn-layoffs-on-air-talent/index.html



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Re: ESPN Loses 4M subs in the past year

Postby DfromCT » Wed Apr 26, 2017 6:30 pm

I'm sorry, but knowing a few of the people laid off, and the guy that ultimately made the decisions, I think its disgusting that some are celebrating these layoffs. These are individual people, most with families. You may have tons of issues with ESPN, I don't doubt that. But to celebrate someone else's misery is just plain wrong. I get your point about having so many people to discuss a sporting event, but when folks that have LEAD THE WAY breaking stories about NCAA conference re-alignment, NFL scandals, and NHL behind the scenes stories are let go do to working in an industry that's undergoing massive changes, it's nothing to celebrate. I, too take issue with ESPN which is a big corporation. I feel for the folks that are, as of today, unemployed.

These are not, for the most part, folks that were making millions of dollars. Some may have made big money elsewhere, others built a career and got paid for it. But they're professionals that are out of work. For the most part, they've showed their professionalism by the messages they've sent on various social media. I haven't seen anyone bashing ESPN, the vast majority celebrate their years there. Most will find another job, but anyone that's been fired due to no fault of their own can tell you, it just sucks when it happens to you.


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Re: ESPN Loses 4M subs in the past year

Postby lurker123 » Wed Apr 26, 2017 9:48 pm

DfromCT, Your point is well taken. It is never a happy thing when someone loses their job in a layoff either from an economic, family or community viewpoint.

However ESPN's arrogance has been in a league by itself and its policies have enabled if not literally created the P5 and done tangible damage to the Tulanes of the world. Sorry but this is about more than the just punishment for hubris. If ESPN truly finds its past behavior enabling the folks who have screwed Tulane is no longer profitable and changes/abandons this line of action then, yes, many of us here are happy that ESPN is weaker.



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Re: ESPN Loses 4M subs in the past year

Postby lurker123 » Wed Apr 26, 2017 11:02 pm

This is a good business analysis of ESPN's situation and notes/links to discussions that ESPN evolving into MSESPN only has worsened its plight.

http://www.outkickthecoverage.com/espn- ... day-042617



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Re: ESPN Loses 4M subs in the past year

Postby DfromCT » Thu Apr 27, 2017 6:59 am

lurker123 wrote:DfromCT, Your point is well taken. It is never a happy thing when someone loses their job in a layoff either from an economic, family or community viewpoint.

However ESPN's arrogance has been in a league by itself and its policies have enabled if not literally created the P5 and done tangible damage to the Tulanes of the world. Sorry but this is about more than the just punishment for hubris. If ESPN truly finds its past behavior enabling the folks who have screwed Tulane is no longer profitable and changes/abandons this line of action then, yes, many of us here are happy that ESPN is weaker.


I see your point, and saw it before you posted it. My point is that the folks that are celebrating layoffs are dancing at the misery of INDIVIDUALS that had no say in the role ESPN the CORPORATION played in creating the "haves" versus the "have nots." I also think that the Tulane's of the world have themselves (ourselves) to blame WAY more than ESPN, and certainly 1,000 % more than the individuals that reported on sports.


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Re: ESPN Loses 4M subs in the past year

Postby lurker123 » Thu Apr 27, 2017 7:18 am

DfromCT wrote:
lurker123 wrote:DfromCT, Your point is well taken. It is never a happy thing when someone loses their job in a layoff either from an economic, family or community viewpoint.

However ESPN's arrogance has been in a league by itself and its policies have enabled if not literally created the P5 and done tangible damage to the Tulanes of the world. Sorry but this is about more than the just punishment for hubris. If ESPN truly finds its past behavior enabling the folks who have screwed Tulane is no longer profitable and changes/abandons this line of action then, yes, many of us here are happy that ESPN is weaker.


I see your point, and saw it before you posted it. My point is that the folks that are celebrating layoffs are dancing at the misery of INDIVIDUALS that had no say in the role ESPN the CORPORATION played in creating the "haves" versus the "have nots." I also think that the Tulane's of the world have themselves (ourselves) to blame WAY more than ESPN, and certainly 1,000 % more than the individuals that reported on sports.


Again I don't applaud "creative destruction" in economics or anything else. May these folks land on their feet quickly.

Yes Tulane could have zigged rather than zagged just like the cowboy getting out of the way of the buffalo stampede. We must have 100,000+ posts here shining a bright light on what SC and team and others since Rufus Harris did to Tulane athletics.

Regardless the monopolists here have fundamentally damaged Tulane and they should be held accountable. By bankrolling the P5 and meanwhile using its editorial platform to proclaim 24/7/365 the virtues of P5 status and the corresponding denigration of the unwashed mid-majors, ESPN has represented a fundamental barrier to entry for Tulane to improve its position. Yes money matters but it's the "P5 Branding" with no meaningful avenue to attain it that is the most insidious danger to Tulane's long term marketing image both in athletics and otherwise. I'm all for putting a stake in the heart of that.

Finally folks who hop on the monopolist train because the living is easy and the future is bright shouldn't act too surprised about their new discomfort when that train derails.



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Re: ESPN Loses 4M subs in the past year

Postby DfromCT » Thu Apr 27, 2017 7:38 am

lurker123 wrote:Finally folks who hop on the monopolist train because the living is easy and the future is bright shouldn't act too surprised about their new discomfort when that train derails.


I don't think anyone was surprised, nor bitter. Virtually all comments, tweets, and other social media I've read said they cherished their days at ESPN and read the tea leaves well before the cuts came down. There will be more cuts to follow. You can dance around the campfire for months to come.


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Re: ESPN Loses 4M subs in the past year

Postby Houma de Wave » Thu Apr 27, 2017 7:51 am

Excellent piece. This was academic. ESPN has been asking for this for a looong time.



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Re: ESPN Loses 4M subs in the past year

Postby golfnut69 » Thu Apr 27, 2017 8:08 am

Houma de Wave wrote:Excellent piece. This was academic. ESPN has been asking for this for a looong time.


I agree...and I am enjoying their slow death spiral....now if they wish to cover and present sports, I may actually tune in again..but I have tired of their PC bullsh*t and the "backstory"...I could give a rats ass less about Jenner or if Michael Sam likes it in the ass, just let me know if he/she can play ball...there are enuff PC channels and espn does not need to continue to be one, if they do they will be gone sooner than they think and in it's current programming mode, the sooner the better


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Re: ESPN Loses 4M subs in the past year

Postby Aberzombie1892 » Thu Apr 27, 2017 9:44 am

This may not be so great of event in regard to the AAC's tv rights, as the AAC will need as many serious bidders as possible, and, if ESPN, is willing to bet the farm on P5 rights, it may not be able to offer much for the AAC. In theory, this wouldn't be as big as an issue as it historically would have been since there are now more players in the market place with the addition of streaming providers. That being said, streaming providers are still an untested commodity in regard to NCAA football rights and Netflix's CEO indicated earlier this year that Netflix is not interested in live sports. Assuming that Netflix doesn't change CEO between now and when the AAC's rights are up and thus Netflix won't bid on the AAC's rights, that leaves the traditional ESPN, FOX, CBS and ABC networks (including subsidiaries) along with the only meaningful new entrants likely being Twitter and Hulu. Considering that ESPN is going through money issues and may not be able to be competitive with its bids, that AAC's new contract may be in a precarious position if Twitter and Hulu are not interested in bidding.



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Re: ESPN Loses 4M subs in the past year

Postby lurker123 » Thu Apr 27, 2017 10:09 am

I saw one other interesting comment on this today. Sports is Darwinian. "Perform or you're gone. Win or you're outta here." Posters here have said it about Tulane admins and coaches at least 10,000+ times.

I don't think it would take much of an internet search to find numerous comments through the years by many of the ESPN folks laid off yesterday advocating that owners be replaced, GMs or coaches be fired or players be cut or traded for example. I imagine it would not be hard to find such expressed with little or no sympathy to the folks they wanted canned and almost always with gimlet eye precision and even occasionally with some brio.

As I said, may any of these folks who need jobs find them quickly. However as to their relationship with ESPN perhaps a paraphrase from Shakespeare is best, "Why, man, they did make love to this employment" with the not-surprising consequences.



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Re: ESPN Loses 4M subs in the past year

Postby msdos » Thu Apr 27, 2017 10:58 am

DfromCT wrote:I'm sorry, but knowing a few of the people laid off, and the guy that ultimately made the decisions, I think its disgusting that some are celebrating these layoffs. These are individual people, most with families.

Honestly, this is how I felt about Dannen firing most of the department.
Million dollar coaches are one thing, but people who had no say in the poor direction we've headed for the past 20ish years seemed egregious.



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Re: ESPN Loses 4M subs in the past year

Postby DfromCT » Thu Apr 27, 2017 12:00 pm

This cannot help the AAC w/r/t our next media rights contract. ESPN will be offering the P5's less money, so all bidders will be keeping bids down rather than trying to outbid one another. I think the AAC will get more money than the current (bought on the cheap) deal, but not nearly anything close to what the P5's currently receive. Half would be a major, MAJOR coup for Arresco.

And if TV/Media rights goes the route of only paying for what you watch, Tulane is done athletically. We need to win in a big way between now and the first half of the next decade.


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Re: ESPN Loses 4M subs in the past year

Postby Aberzombie1892 » Thu Apr 27, 2017 12:34 pm

DfromCT wrote:This cannot help the AAC w/r/t our next media rights contract. ESPN will be offering the P5's less money, so all bidders will be keeping bids down rather than trying to outbid one another. I think the AAC will get more money than the current (bought on the cheap) deal, but not nearly anything close to what the P5's currently receive. Half would be a major, MAJOR coup for Arresco.


A new contract at $12-15M per team (~half of P5 tv only revenue - no NCAA units/bowl revenue/network revenue/etc.) would be extraordinary given the current deal and would be enough to get convince BYU and Boise to join the AAC. However, that seems unlikely since the market has continued to show that big players will overpay for elite content (P5/NFL), but underpay for content not considered to be elite (everything else). As a very recent example, Amazon just paid $50M for 10 NFL games - that's ridiculous on paper, but, if Amazon experiences the increases in subscribers/viewers that Twitter did the year before when it owned those exact same rights, it's certainly worth it on the financial end. That's the difficult part for the AAC - it's content isn't really elite in the sense that no tv network/streaming provider will see a significant increase in viewers/subscribers solely by purchasing the AAC tv rights the way that they would by buying the rights to the B1G, SEC, B12, ACC, PAC12, and/or NFL.



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Re: ESPN Loses 4M subs in the past year

Postby winwave » Thu Apr 27, 2017 12:57 pm

msdos wrote:
DfromCT wrote:I'm sorry, but knowing a few of the people laid off, and the guy that ultimately made the decisions, I think its disgusting that some are celebrating these layoffs. These are individual people, most with families.

Honestly, this is how I felt about Dannen firing most of the department.
Million dollar coaches are one thing, but people who had no say in the poor direction we've headed for the past 20ish years seemed egregious.


I get how you and some others see it and no one likes to see anybody get fired. However in the case of the Tulane employees none of them sought out to other schools who actually sought to win. They were just fine having their jobs and not having any pressure to perform. So most did need to go.


It's the facilities stupid!

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Re: ESPN Loses 4M subs in the past year

Postby winwave » Thu Apr 27, 2017 12:58 pm

Aresco is a damn good commissioner but no one will be able to get much if any more for the AAC in the next TV contract. The product is not compelling and the money won't be there.


It's the facilities stupid!

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Re: ESPN Loses 4M subs in the past year

Postby DfromCT » Thu Apr 27, 2017 2:44 pm

Aberzombie1892 wrote:
DfromCT wrote:This cannot help the AAC w/r/t our next media rights contract. ESPN will be offering the P5's less money, so all bidders will be keeping bids down rather than trying to outbid one another. I think the AAC will get more money than the current (bought on the cheap) deal, but not nearly anything close to what the P5's currently receive. Half would be a major, MAJOR coup for Arresco.


A new contract at $12-15M per team (~half of P5 tv only revenue - no NCAA units/bowl revenue/network revenue/etc.) would be extraordinary given the current deal and would be enough to get convince BYU and Boise to join the AAC. However, that seems unlikely since the market has continued to show that big players will overpay for elite content (P5/NFL), but underpay for content not considered to be elite (everything else). As a very recent example, Amazon just paid $50M for 10 NFL games - that's ridiculous on paper, but, if Amazon experiences the increases in subscribers/viewers that Twitter did the year before when it owned those exact same rights, it's certainly worth it on the financial end. That's the difficult part for the AAC - it's content isn't really elite in the sense that no tv network/streaming provider will see a significant increase in viewers/subscribers solely by purchasing the AAC tv rights the way that they would by buying the rights to the B1G, SEC, B12, ACC, PAC12, and/or NFL.


I agree, which is why I think it will be a major coup if he was able to get that kind of money. Realistically, the only hope we have of getting something along the lines of $6-10 million/conference member would be if there's an entry to the (expanded playoff) for the AAC or a top G5 team and/or if the other media players are willing to outbid each other in search of content. But I agree, the AAC is not compelling content, but with all the different outlets combined, content COULD be in demand.


" For every alum, no matter where they are...I want a football coach that's going to make Saturday something you anticipate and look forward to." Troy Dannen

Thank you all for your ongoing support as my son Zach continues to beat leukemia

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